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Can I cancel my "LGBT" soul contract?

Oh, dear Beßerwißers and toe nail engineers... Fire is something that could burn your house down and kill you. This is a forum for discussion.

How did the inhabitants of the earth end up? Several of you were once soldiers on the front. And now you can't handle a comment section on the internet. You should try pregnancy and childbirth once. Create the incarnation, make life possible and press it out of your body by own muscle force. It cultivates the soul, and strengens it, to be the one who makes life as human being for another soul, possible at all.

Just try the experience once. It uplifts the soul. The act of creation.
 
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Stewardess, what you say sounds ridiculous and ignorant to me. The cliched parent who finds out their child is gay..."Can't you just not be gay?".

I love brunette women, spaghetti bolognese, I dont have a sweet tooth etc...

These aren't conscious decisions I've made, they are my preferances. Its just stuff I like.

I can't wake up tomorrow and decide to be gay anymore than a gay person can decide to be straight IMO.
 
Jim78 said:
I can't wake up tomorrow and decide to be gay anymore than a gay person can decide to be straight IMO.
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Hey, I agree with Ester that this is just one of the possibilities in life. It's not mandatory or a rule or applicable to every person. It happened to a close friend of mine. The best proof is that we asked her specifically (I am talking about decades ago) if she wasn't better of in a lesbian relationship because she was relentlessly chasing unavailable men or having short relationships. She said it had crossed her mind as well but she was just attracted to men and not to women.
Fast forward ten or twenty years in time and she ended up in a stable long-term relationship with a woman.

We are all in a spectrum of bi-sexuality (tri-sexuality etc). This doesn't mean that people should be forced to change their preferences.
 
What are we in a spectrum of though fireflydancing? Sure...I can agree that certain psychological quirks or trauma can confuse a person as to their preferences but, as you know, a mature, confident person who is at ease with their sexuality knows exactly what they prefer.

Why do I like Bolognese and dislike chips? There is no deep rooted psychological reason for many preferences people have. Its just what they like or am I on a 'spectrum' of Italian food preferences?

In my view calling sexuality a spectrum does disservice to the complex nature of human preference. Its only a spectrum if one wants to believe everyone is a little bit gay.

I know gay men that are literally disgusted by my sexual preference. They can't fathom why I desire women any more than I can fathom what they see in, to my mind, the ugliest and smelliest of beasts...men.
 
Morning Tanker.

I get completely what is meant by a 'spectrum' but I still think that leaving binary preferences at each end of a straight line between the two does do a disservice to human preferance.

As an example. If we put my love of bolognese at one end of a spectrum and my dislike of chips at another then how would one fit my eating beef into such a direct line?

Sometimes I love beef, at other times its the last thing in the world I want to eat, therefore I see binary opposites connected by a spectrum line of food preferences to discount the fact that sometimes I may run hot and cold on some preferences.

Do you see what I'm saying? Human preference, to me, isn't a two dimensional line from one binary to the other. That's blues music. Preference, to me, is a three dimensional structure more complex than can be pinned into a spectrum. That's jazz, freeform, loose, yet always couched in a form.

The wonder is in the fact that everyone is different and complex in infinite ways IMO.
 
Hey Jim,
I think this discussion is not about you and your preferences, but about things that might happen in life. I know and have known a lot of gay people and their stories are all different. Some were gay from childhood, others discovered new preferences after straight relationships, some self-declared straight people turned around. I can even tell you that an intimate gay (male) friend one day decided that he wanted to know what it was to make love to a woman (me) I declined. And he was very very gay.
 
Hi fireflydancing.

By thinking I am merely talking about my personal preferences completely misses the point of what I'm trying to convey. I'm simply using examples.

I believe that I illustrated it clearly in my jazz and blues analogy.

You confirmed the point I was making. That human preference is about playing jazz in three dimensions not playing blues in two dimensions. Thanks.
 
The fact that you mentioned tri-sexuality indicates that there is more going on than a mere spectrum. Non linear viewpoints must be applied IMO.
 
fireflydancing said:
Hey Jim,
I think this discussion is not about you and your preferences, but about things that might happen in life.
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I beg to differ.

This is SheSearches's thread and it is about supporting and helping that member.

It seems a fair number of posts make no mention whatsoever of the original post and have no interest in the human being who posted it, but are intent on having their own discussion here. My feeling is that many of these posts don't belong in this thread.
 
Hi Tanker.

Yup...IMO we have infinite choices, yet conversely we are enslaved to our preferences, but we enjoy them so it doesn't matter.

I think personally that one must make peace with ones preferences rather than oppose them. There's no point fighting with yourself you know?

Hi Speedwell.

Personally I found Stewardesses advice to the OP to be very irresponsible. That member came here to express her battle between what she prefers and what she wishes to be. Stewardesses comments circumvented all that and insisted that she DID have a choice.

I was compelled to post because I realise that preferences are not always choices, they are simply what we like.

If Stewardess wishes to directly engage the OP on whether or not she has a choice I find it very productive to challenge those assertions. Thus the OP has a more rounded view of others feedback. THEN she has a choice, to follow the path of outlook that best suits her.

Surely that is why many members are compelled to post? To explore avenues?

I find the discussion here about choice versus preference to be very relevent to what the OP posted.

Perhaps you should look at the bigger picture?
 
Speedwell said:
It seems a fair number of posts make no mention whatsoever of the original post and have no interest in the human being who posted it, but are intent on having their own discussion here. My feeling is that many of these posts don't belong in this thread.
Click to expand...
I thought there was a lot of discussion on the complications of human sexuality which was the point of SheSearches' post and intended to provide her with a variety of views. The fact that we didn't mention it or her directly but were discussing the subject was (I thought) trying to be helpful to SheSearches! I'm genuinely surprised you feel we have no interest in her. Amongst others, I've tried to do my best to help, despite some negative comments, and my primary interest these days is concern for new members and how they will view this forum and feel welcome. I think it's inevitable that in the course of discussion we have the occasional lapse of focus, so apologies if I happen to have contributed to that. It's good to have a reminder when we do slip up, but I'm pretty sure most people's motives are unselfish.
 
Where were there any lapses of focus Tanker? We stayed on track discussing exactly what SheSearches put forward in her original post.

Is Speedwell suggesting that topics must not generate debate? That seems to run counter to the intent of this forum IMO. Why would anyone post here if its not to be discussed?

Should I have just read Stewardesses opinion and not responded for fear of being taken to task by a moderator? That makes no sense IMO....
 
Hi Tanker.

What you call tangents a Dubliner would call 'the banter'. Sure....I mentioned an escalator to Heaven but what is engaging with people without the casual, human touch?

We can all give virtual hugs and proclaim our interest but, IMO, bantering is the type of thing that truly puts people at ease and maybe even might form friendships. Because we get to know each other.

Are we to write rote, uniform words with bland expressions of sentiments or are we to engage as people, with differing opinions?
 
Just one important clarification on this subject that I'd like to add here:

The souls incarnation into a body has certain purpouses. And the body has its functions. One of its functions is hunger and eating. And the reason for it, is that you stay alive and healthy, that the body can function properly.

Another function of the body is the sexuality, which is a function that is deeply connected to althruism and love for other souls throughout the whole universe. The purpous of the sexuality is to help us on the spiritual level to find that single one compementary person who we engage into the creating act along with, as we make our children - whos bodies are those that souls incarnate into. This is how our sexuality, along with another compementary person, can create the possibility for the incarnation of a soul. This is the reason for a person having sexuality at all; that we in our earthly and fleshly nature, can share the altruism and love with the whole universe, by providing incarnation to earth for other souls through the gateway of our own bodies.

One needs to use the rationality and the will of the self, to be able to use sexuality to serve the purpous of both the body and altrustic love for the whole creation at the same time. This is why sex is not about taste and pleasure really. Used for its right purpous it is creation, altruism and art.

This knowlege of the force of the sexual orientation of the male and female bodies, has been known by humanity for several thousends of years. How to use the sexuality correctly, and not disuse it that we hurt other people, is really antient knowlege.
 
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tanker said:
I thought there was a lot of discussion on the complications of human sexuality which was the point of SheSearches' post and intended to provide her with a variety of views. The fact that we didn't mention it or her directly but were discussing the subject was (I thought) trying to be helpful to SheSearches! I'm genuinely surprised you feel we have no interest in her.
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Thanks for your thoughts.

I tend to evaluate things based on the likelihood of the absent OP returning and rejoining the thread. That's a purely subjective viewpoint of course, and I can't know what is in someone else's mind.
 
Speedwell said:
Personally I'm sceptical about the "lesson" interpretation of life. To me it actually adds to the burden, "Oh, this is supposed to be a lesson, therefore it is supposed to be hard!".

My opinion is that sometimes we need to give ourselves (and others!) a break. Life can be difficult, sometimes all we can do is just whatever we can do to get by. Making it from one day to the next is really what it's about some of the time.

One thing which I gather from the opening post, sounds like the pressure comes from living within a family or social group where one cannot "be oneself". That is a very normal thing, and (forgive me if I'm wrong) can be part of growing up and eventually moving out into one's own path in the world. Time spent in a difficult situation can seem never-ending, but sooner or later we find a way to be among people we can feel more comfortable with. I hope that happens for you, SheSearches.

Don't lose hope - these times as a young adult can be among the most challenging for many people, but the good news is things usually get better as time goes on, things tend to sort themselves out and gradually fall into place.
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When we take out "life lessons" out of reincarnation, we will throw laws of Karma out of window.
All explanations of transformation along the repeated earthly lives are interesting to me. Like somebody said: "A man builds a house for himself. After moving to the house he has built, we don't make questions about him living in that house." For the most part the house is according to his skills.
Let's take a positive case:
A person goes through a life where he is inhabiting a handicapped body, with an undeveloped brain. All his experiences transforms to the need to dedicate his next earth life for helping handicapped people with understanding, loving attitude.
I don't see the connections myself, but I just have the inner trust to some of the claims I have encountered.
 
Peace of mind said:
When we take out "life lessons" out of reincarnation, we will throw laws of Karma out of window.
All explanations of transformation along the repeated earthly lives are interesting to me. Like somebody said: "A man builds a house for himself. After moving to the house he has built, we don't make questions about him living in that house." For the most part the house is according to his skills.
Let's take a positive case:
A person goes through a life where he is inhabiting a handicapped body, with an undeveloped brain. All his experiences transforms to the need to dedicate his next earth life for helping handicapped people with understanding, loving attitude.
I don't see the connections myself, but I just have the inner trust to some of the claims I have encountered.
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Personally, I have difficulty with all of this. I try (though I don't always succeed) to treat everyone well, and that means (for me at least) just accepting people as they are, take people on their own terms, as they wish to be understood. Because of that, I need to abandon all preconceptions or assumptions about other people. To be honest, I find anything more than simple acceptance to be very limiting, restrictive.

I was brought up with religious ideas instilled as part of the education system. As I grew up, I found those ideas often fell apart when looked at too deeply, so I set them aside. Having thus freed myself from these entanglements, I've no wish to take on board another set of religious ideas in which to become entangled once more. I've certainly looked at these things, the ideas are not new to me, I looked at ideas from East and West as well as modern interpretations and thoughts. But still, I prefer freedom. Indeed one of the phrases I often use to describe my outlook is that I like to travel light. That is, not carry too much baggage.
 
Your reply has the mood of zen Buddhism. It is ok for me.
But this is a past life forum. And we are bringing burdens and strengths from our previous lives..Or aren't we?
 
Peace of mind said:
Your reply has the mood of zen Buddhism. It is ok for me.
But this is a past life forum. And we are bringing burdens and strengths from our previous lives..Or aren't we?
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Ok, you are correct, this is a past life forum.

The only reason I ever took past lives seriously, rather than just think of it as a curious idea, was because I had something inside myself which could not be explained in any other way. As soon as I considered past lives, everything started to make sense. As for bringing things with us from past lives, yes of course. It does require some consideration, because on the one hand I view this life as a simple continuation of what went before. On the other hand, this is also a completely different life in a different time and place, in a different physical body, with different childhood influences. So much is different. So much is the same. Determining which part is the same, is where we find ourselves, our eternal self.

Earlier I did say this thread was for responding to the OP, SheSearches and her question. I'm clearly getting off-track here too, and I apologise for that. This is a long way from the original topic and should probably take place in a different thread.
 
Hi Firefly/Polaris,

I am blasting back to the past, since I have been out of town for a bit. This allowed me to avoid entanglement in some "physical plane gender" debates that went on over the last few pages in the meantime (for better or worse). However, my conversation with you two related to the question of ultimate gender, as opposed to manifest gender in the physical. Obviously, we are at issue on this point. Polaris claims experience in terms of ascent to planes of being beyond gender, while Firefly claims memory of numerous past lives as a male before her more recent series of female lives (over the last 500 years or so). I see no reason to dispute either of your accounts, but nonetheless dispute your conclusions.

As to Polaris' points:

In terms of my overview, as previously stated, it is primarily based on what I consider to be experimental verification by Ian Stevenson (to the extent I am familiar with his results and conclusions) and my own studies and observations. However, its manifestation is, as also discussed above, going to be based on the level/plane of being in question. Thus, moving beyond the physical, reliable NDE and OOBE reports seem to verify continuance of personal gender differences, and maintenance of the current or possibly remembered physical appearance. From there, moving "upward" (and accepting the fairly standard terminology for different planes of existence that Polaris uses):

"From my experience during conscious OBE's over the years gender seems to somewhat exist on the astral plane as we tend to still keep the same form and personality as we did in our last earth life. However as we transcend beyond the astral into the mental plane (where the universe mind occurs) the aspect of gender starts to blend together as this is the world of pure universal mind. As the mental body starts to reflect more of our spiritual character from all of the PL we have lived while in the lower worlds of duality. (Emphasis added).

Duality itself ends once soul transcends past the mental plane and into the causal or soul plane. Here soul is above time, space, matter and duality itself. It is here that soul is stripped of all lower body forms as we know it as human beings and is in its pure naked form of pure consciousness itself. So with no define form there is no gender here."

So far so good; however, as far as I can tell, in the mental plane any blending in terms of thought patterns, mentation, etc. is going to be gender skewed based on proportion of past lives in a particular "base" gender, though leavened by experience in the opposite gender. (This is somewhat confirmed by the underlined part of your statements above). However, the "rubber meets the road" so to speak in the causal plane, where gender has become--from my standpoint---potential/latent rather than actualized. Nonetheless, IMO gender still exists in latent form in the causal as well. In the causal it is, so to speak, in seed form.

Hmm. I'm going to switch over to a physical analogy that will perhaps clarify what I am trying to say. The fertilized egg--a simple sphere--is the source and "causal" basis of the developing human embryo and ultimate male/female body. From the standpoint of the outside observer, it is completely without gender. However, each fertilized egg already has within it (barring some genetic aberration) an XX (female) or XY (male) chromosome pair. Nonetheless, it will remain without any discernable outside gender differences through many subsequent stages of development before an ultrasound can clearly tell whether it is a boy or girl, i.e., its latent gender becomes its detectable and manifest external gender. Similarly, I see the causal existence as one where gender has become latent, but will manifest in due course in lower planes of existence. Even when latent, however, the being has "gender"--it is merely latent at that stage of existence just as it is in the undifferentiated fertilized ovum. As the being descends/moves into more differentiated states/planes of being, innate gender will cause gender related differences to appear as part of the process. These differences, while real, do not bar cross-gender physical incarnations, though they seem to be the cause of some problems.

As to Firefly's points:

Statistically speaking, numerous cross-gender prior lives remembered don't really prove anything, as we don't know the total number of past lives that have been lived or that all lives are being remembered. Your cross-gender PLs may also be more "memorable" because of the contrasts involved. It is also possible that souls vary more and are more experimental in their choices initially before they settle into their preferred gender pattern. Even with that, however, there seems to continue to be variation from time-to-time, whatever the reason. Also, across the broad spectrum of people, there will always be some variation. As the saying goes, the exceptions prove the rule. It should also be noted that--on the other side of the coin--there are also those like Jim78 and seemingly Patton who remember only single gender lives (maybe there is some kind of warrior tie-in on that one). Anyhow, I have no problems with variations, but I think the general rule remains.

Great points by both of you, and an interesting discussion from my standpoint!:)

Cordially,
S&S

PS--Polaris--Beyond the causal plane, I am not prepared to speculate. Anyhow, I barely can get my comprehension to wrap around the concepts related to the causal. That's as far as I want to go at this point! :cool:
 
Hi S&S.

As far as my own view on it I can only speak from my own experiences and I do believe in the divine feminine and the divine masculine.

As I've said numerous times before on this forum I see a pattern of manifestations of things I have learned throughout my many lives. In my case these manifestations have occurred through my essential 'maleness'.

Whether one wants to ruminate on such thinking through psychology or just the differing opportunities available to men and women throughout history and theorise what these earthbound expressions of gender means for the individual souls journey I find we can all agree that differing genders offer differing opportunities to experience.

I personally can understand a little of why I only remember male lives. They come from feelings. Its the little things that have me questioning souls hopping from gender to gender. Things like how I have felt looking at a woman I love. I have never experienced ( to the best of my knowledge ) being a woman in love but I seriously doubt that a woman would look at me, as an incarnate male, the way I might look at her.

Things like this leave me scratching my head as to what's going on and with regard to my 'need' to incarnate as a warrior again and again, I keep coming back to what I said in one of my first posts on this forum. "What would a warrior need to learn from baking cookies?"

It just doesn't seem to be the trip my soul is on. I can't speak for anyone else though.
 
Hi Jim,

It is interesting to me how the good old "Bell Curve" seems to show up all over the place. It showed up repeatedly when I was studying the physical sciences. I met it again in the biological, psychological and sociological sciences. In terms of the latter group, most people fall into the middle of the Bell Curve somewhere, with only a comparative few at the extremes. For example, the vast majority (around 90%) of people are right handed. Only about 10% are left handed or ambidextrous, and it is only around 1% that is considered to be truly ambidextrous. Likewise, the vast majority of people apparently identify as ordinary m/f heterosexual, leaving a small percentage who do not, and once again those who are truly bi-sexual (or nonsexual/asexual) seem to represent an even smaller percentage of the second group. What is true in the human microcosm also seems to be true in the physics macrocosm: The Universe, so to speak, greatly prefers matter over anti-matter (sometimes referred to as Baryon Asymmetry).

Yet, there seems to be a prevailing and generally unquestioned assumption that what we ultimately are (soul/spirit/etc.) is, so to speak, ambi-gendered, ungendered, or neuter. I don't dispute the right of anyone to take and argue this position. It certainly has religious and philosophical support. Likewise, I believe the opposite position can be supported from a religious/philosophical viewpoint. We are early in the data gathering process when it comes to these matters, but I do not see anything that clearly disproves the idea that the vast majority if not all souls/spirits are gendered. In fact, I believe the data provides better support for this position than the ungendered position.

Consequently, I'm always a bit surprised when people react to my position with seeming astonishment as if it was something absurd or preposterous.

Cordially,
S&S
 
SeaAndSky said:
Hi Jim,

It is interesting to me how the good old "Bell Curve" seems to show up all over the place. It showed up repeatedly when I was studying the physical sciences. I met it again in the biological, psychological and sociological sciences. In terms of the latter group, most people fall into the middle of the Bell Curve somewhere, with only a comparative few at the extremes. For example, the vast majority (around 90%) of people are right handed. Only about 10% are left handed or ambidextrous, and it is only around 1% that is considered to be truly ambidextrous. Likewise, the vast majority of people apparently identify as ordinary m/f heterosexual, leaving a small percentage who do not, and once again those who are truly bi-sexual (or nonsexual/asexual) seem to represent an even smaller percentage of the second group. What is true in the human microcosm also seems to be true in the physics macrocosm: The Universe, so to speak, greatly prefers matter over anti-matter (sometimes referred to as Baryon Asymmetry).

Yet, there seems to be a prevailing and generally unquestioned assumption that what we ultimately are (soul/spirit/etc.) is, so to speak, ambi-gendered, ungendered, or neuter. I don't dispute the right of anyone to take and argue this position. It certainly has religious and philosophical support. Likewise, I believe the opposite position can be supported from a religious/philosophical viewpoint. We are early in the data gathering process when it comes to these matters, but I do not see anything that clearly disproves the idea that the vast majority if not all souls/spirits are gendered. In fact, I believe the data provides better support for this position than the ungendered position.

Consequently, I'm always a bit surprised when people react to my position with seeming astonishment as if it was something absurd or preposterous.

Cordially,
S&S
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Hi, S&S:

The division into genders occurred during the Evolution among the living species here on Earth to somehow compensate for incessant errors in DNA copying in the living cells. Just like the last modification in the new British coronavirus. In this way, the grown individuals are able to kind of purge their DNAs in the moment of giving life to a new individual, by simply combining their DNAs and discarding the - more or less randomly situated - errors in their codes. If the future father has an error in the code at some place, then the future mother's code will be used, and vice-versa, or the new individual will inherit that error and most surely die of it.

Can you explain, what errors is compensating the division of bodiless souls into genders?

And, bye-the bye, are there among the souls right-handed, left-handed, ambi-dextrous, too? What for?

N.B.
The matter-antimatter assymetry has nothing to do with this. Each time a new Universe is created and all its innumerable parameters are randomly (?) assigned their new values, there well may (?) occur Universes where anti-matter prevails over what we call matter, or even, where no such assymmetry exists and all is just light. Anthropic principle, they call it, I guess.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthropic_principle

IMHO.

Best regards.
 
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fireflydancing said:
I think our core spirit is genderless. This is my belief, my truth.

On a personal level, I reckon that I've been reincarnating an awful lot of times as a female lately. And I feel female this time just for being a mother (and for feeling attracted to men), I don't have a female mindset in my way of thinking. I am conditioned to keep myself safe in this world (being a woman), so I can't follow all my ideas and interests.
I am always more than interested in the topic of gender and transgenders despite my belief that our core spirits are genderless. Because... that's the way my spirit wants to experience. I highly believe that in my former life I was male and that I always knew something was 'off' with me. I think I had taken some residues of female life with me that time.
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Firefly, How observant of you to understand this. Yes! in our natural state as soul without a physical body we are actually gender neutral. We only experience gender as we understand it on this planet when we are incarnated in the physical. In between lifetimes we have memories of being both male and female and what those experiences taught us in those lifetimes but in our natural state we are a perfect balance of both polarities of consciousness. In this life I am male and believe I was in the last lifetimes as well even though I did not live long in that one. However I also know I have been female in other ones as well as I do have some memories of being a female prostitute' in France during the French Revolution. I was in that life a very attractive red head and I used men in a way so that I could survive as a independent women which during that time period of very rare.

Being gay in this lifetime I have learned to be in balance with both male and female aspects of my consciousness. You would never know looking at me physically as I am a bodybuilder with a edgy hard core motorcycle biker look about me tattoos and all. But on the inside I am very deep, sensitive and in touch with my feelings and that of others. Which is why when people get to know me that say I look very different on the outside then how I really am on the inside. Part of this is because I had to learn to be tuff and rugged in order to survive in a male dominate world during the early part of my life. As I got older as I am 61 now the world has changed some but still has a ways to go at least on a global level with the balancing of female energy on the planet.

Thanks for your insightful post my dear.


Love and Peace
P.
 
Hi Cyrus,

My examples are only intended to show that neutrality is not a favored position in terms of what we see around us in the universe. As I noted in my original post on this thread (#5), gender seems to be part of the pattern of duality--and even more, polarity--that is inherent in the structure of the universe. Therefore to me, sex appears to be only the expression at the physical level of a more universal principle (gender) that transcends the physical level.

However, my basic problem with your use of biological examples is that they are completely unconnected to any theory/hypothesis or stated belief in terms of the nature of spirit/soul that would make your observations related to the evolution of sex in the physical realm relevant to the question of gender in the spirit realm. What is the paradigm you are working from? Do you have any kind of overarching metanarrative in terms of the interaction of spirit and matter and the direction (if any) of the process we are involved in?

Assuming evolution as a paradigm, are souls/spirits on a parallel track of evolution from an undifferentiated beginning along with their associated biological life forms? If so, why would spirits not also develop/evolve gender as a basis for thoroughly and effectively interfacing with those biological life forms? It seems to me that spirits would develop into two types (genders) as well, with each adapted to interface with a particular sex. Without a form fixed in matter, spirits might be more versatile in terms of interfacing with an opposite sex body in the physical, but there could also be problems and discomfort (which seems to be supported by Stevenson's research).

On the other hand, why just two, why not three as we find with aquatic vs. amphibious vs. land based life forms? Is it possible that some spirits become thoroughly adapted to a male role, some to a female role, and some to mixed/intermediate roles (just as some life forms became thoroughly adapted to an aquatic life, some to a land based life, and some to an amphibious life)? In this regard, a particular body sex and sex role is part of the "environment" in which the spirit lives in the physical, just as water or land is another part of its physical environment. Further, the more thoroughly and better adapted to life in one environment, the less comfortable life forms are in alternative environments (in this case, sex/gender roles). Alternately, in an evolutionary model with both physical and spiritual evolution, why would physical bodies/types evolve and spirits not evolve/change in tandem reflecting the same changes?

Assuming colonization as a paradigm (which I have also heard used), with spirit beings having their origins elsewhere (i.e., in some other dimension) and basically seeking to colonize and live in and through the physical, there might be two models. In one, spirits are already gendered, and seek to shape physical life to meet their needs and preferences. In another, they would develop preferences and seek to adapt just as in the evolutionary model.

Assuming creation as a paradigm, why not gendered spirits? This seems to be the model held in the Abrahamic religions, at least in regard to the creation of human life. Other religions may have their own models for creation, but most have some type of creation story involving the first man and woman, as well as gendered gods. So, once again, gender appears to be inherent or at least an acceptable alternative.

I.e., I can find no reason why it seems axiomatic to so many that spirits cannot be gendered. o_O After all, we know very little about the field from a scientific standpoint, and religions and philosophies vary on such points as well. Where does this certainty come from? My opinion is that spirits have gender, but this is not a dogma, just an opinion.

Cordially,
S&S

PS--Multiverse ideas are fun, but unconfirmed IMO. However, even if so, it doesn't mean that ordinary matter is not the default setting in our particular universe. Likewise, gender may also be the default setting for advanced/intelligent beings for this universe--in the physical as well as in spirit.
 
Thank you everyone for your responses.

I am still reflecting on this and I guess it boils down to my beliefs around karma. I'm scared by "choosi
Polaris8 said:
SheSearches,

I totally feel your pain you are going thru at the moment. Every gay person on this planet that has ever come out , myself included goes thru this. Be it with family, friends, neighbors, fellow employees ect. Which is why coming out is such a painful but necessary process one goes thru. This is because part of ones life lesson being gay is learning to live from ones own inner truth without shame or guilt. This place from within must come from a place of unconditional love first with yourself and then eventually towards others. Because as soul we have no gender. Soul in its natural state is gender neutral. And during the coarse of our many past lives we have all lived on this earth being both male and female in various lives. Being gay in a certain lifetime is just another life lesson for soul to learn to love itself and to also teach others unconditional love thru our presences in the world. Because everyone has a reason and purpose for being here including those that are either gay, bi, transgender ect..
As all life is apart of divine love which comes from the source of all that is or what man terms as god. Which is why nature creates diversity even in the human species.

However being gay can be a karmic payback from lifetimes in the past where we were not so kind and understanding to others who loved differently then ourselves. (Which was my case in lifetimes gone by.) So as soul we choose to come back and experience the very thing we hated the most so that we may learn like the old saying goes to walk in another person’s moccasins before I have a right to judge either him or her. This state of consciousness allows soul to realize and experience that we are all inner connected as soul. As very human being deep down wants to be loved, understood, accepted, feel the need that they belong and have purpose in life.

So those that do not understand you my dear are still very young in spiritual consciousness to see and understand that you have much to give and teach them just by
being you. Trust me most of my birth family does not accept me either however you have two families in life. One of fate the other choice. The one of fate is the one we are born into like it or not. Here is where are biggest karmic lessons are faced with head on. However the one of choice are the souls we choose to be apart of our journey in this life with. The are forged out of the bonds of unconditional love and they love and support us just as we are be it the good, the bad or the in-between. Which is why I have always said blood does not make a family. Love does. So it is important to surround yourself with those that love and support you for you. The real you.

Its a big world out there and you have the ability within you to create the kind of life you want from your own inner truth. And trust me this is by far the better chose. I would rather live in the light of truth then in the darkness of ignorance and hate. It won't be easy at first it never is. But in time things will and do get better. And you will be happier for it in the long run. We all have a part to play in this grand scheme we call life my dear which is why we are all individuals. And you are just as special, beautiful, loved and unique as there are grains of sand on a sandy beach or stars among the heavens.

Peace and love to you...

Polaris
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Thank you, Polaris.

It's funny - I know I don't love myself. I wish I was anyone but me and I have no idea why that is the case for me. Sadly I am unable to remember any past lives I have had to explain a lot of these feelings. My spiritual amnesia is strong! haha. Building the second family, the one you choose might just be a good starting point before I try and make a decision about how I want to live my life.
 
Speedwell said:
Personally I'm sceptical about the "lesson" interpretation of life. To me it actually adds to the burden, "Oh, this is supposed to be a lesson, therefore it is supposed to be hard!".

My opinion is that sometimes we need to give ourselves (and others!) a break. Life can be difficult, sometimes all we can do is just whatever we can do to get by. Making it from one day to the next is really what it's about some of the time.

One thing which I gather from the opening post, sounds like the pressure comes from living within a family or social group where one cannot "be oneself". That is a very normal thing, and (forgive me if I'm wrong) can be part of growing up and eventually moving out into one's own path in the world. Time spent in a difficult situation can seem never-ending, but sooner or later we find a way to be among people we can feel more comfortable with. I hope that happens for you, SheSearches.

Don't lose hope - these times as a young adult can be among the most challenging for many people, but the good news is things usually get better as time goes on, things tend to sort themselves out and gradually fall into place.
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I really hope it gets easier. I'm watching all my straight friends enjoy stable relationships and have children, and it's so depressing not knowing if that will ever get to be me too.
 
SheSearches said:
I really hope it gets easier. I'm watching all my straight friends enjoy stable relationships and have children, and it's so depressing not knowing if that will ever get to be me too.
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I do wish you well.

In another post you said you wish you were anyone else other than yourself. That's something I can relate to, when I was in my later years at school in particular, I used to look around at the others, even people I didn't like or look up to, and wished I could be them instead.

But something came to me, not immediately but some time afterwards, I realised something. I didn't know what went on inside other people's heads, or what sort of family or other situation they had, away from the school environment where I know them, But I understood that what went on inside their heads, their thoughts, their preoccupations, everything would be very different to what went on inside my head. If I really, truly did become that other person, I'd suddenly find my head stuffed with all these other 'alien', very different thoughts, and I would have to give up everything which I considered interesting or worthwhile or important. All of my own hopes and dreams would be vaporised, I would be wiped out. And than I realised I just didn't think that was a price worth paying. No matter what my own pains, struggles and difficulties, I was ME, and that was what mattered.

I hope you can at least accept yourself, see that you have something important, you have life and you are YOU. Learning to love yourself may take longer, but please, do treat yourself as someone of value and importance. You matter.
 
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