Can I cancel my "LGBT" soul contract?

Discussion in 'Reincarnation Questions' started by SheSearches, Dec 16, 2020.

  1. Speedwell

    Speedwell Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    I do wish you well.

    In another post you said you wish you were anyone else other than yourself. That's something I can relate to, when I was in my later years at school in particular, I used to look around at the others, even people I didn't like or look up to, and wished I could be them instead.

    But something came to me, not immediately but some time afterwards, I realised something. I didn't know what went on inside other people's heads, or what sort of family or other situation they had, away from the school environment where I know them, But I understood that what went on inside their heads, their thoughts, their preoccupations, everything would be very different to what went on inside my head. If I really, truly did become that other person, I'd suddenly find my head stuffed with all these other 'alien', very different thoughts, and I would have to give up everything which I considered interesting or worthwhile or important. All of my own hopes and dreams would be vaporised, I would be wiped out. And than I realised I just didn't think that was a price worth paying. No matter what my own pains, struggles and difficulties, I was ME, and that was what mattered.

    I hope you can at least accept yourself, see that you have something important, you have life and you are YOU. Learning to love yourself may take longer, but please, do treat yourself as someone of value and importance. You matter.
     
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  2. SheSearches

    SheSearches New Member

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    This comment makes me question the narrative of karma that I carry about my situation. I think I understand where you are coming from, and actually maybe seeing queerness as a form of karma implies that being gay is a punishment or difficult lesson one has to learn. Why can't it be the gift or blessing I have in this life? My perception of queerness is probably the punishment or difficult lesson.

    You past life is something also worth thinking about - regret. I have never avoided an experience and not regretted it. I do need to stop fighting against myself, and that's going to be tough.

    Thanks so much for your insight.
     
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  3. Jim78

    Jim78 Senior Registered

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    Hi SheSearches.

    I am not gay but my own life experience shows me that not all of us are destined to have an easy route through our love lives.

    Yet, if I may, I have noticed patterns in my own love life that give me insight.

    My first true love placed her public image above any feeling she had for me. It was almost like, in her self hatred, she manifested the highest of contempt for me as I loved her and she couldn't love herself.

    After many years and prisons and homelessness I came to a place of acceptance about myself. The wounds of life inflicted on me gave me peace and confidence...then a new challenge presented itself.

    I fell in love with a woman who wanted to throw off the shackles of public perception of her but found that she couldn't.

    This was opposite to my first love. My first love controlled her actions through public perception because she felt the need to do it to hide deep rooted insecurity.

    My second love controlled her actions through public perception despite the fact she just wanted to be free of it, she was controlled by outside forces.

    My point is that I've found that love, in many iterations, throws up many opposing and concurrent situations that resulted in the same thing....I was alone and single.

    I think that you need to make peace with yourself but also keep in mind that not all of us are destined for happy relationships.

    For me my hurt came from the expectations I placed on destiny not on destiny itself nor on the women I loved. Without expectations and with acceptance of oneself I feel that you will be on the right path to explore your own self.

    After I met my second love I understood that the hurt my first love caused me was about gaining confidence and self esteem for myself, thus I was prepared for my second love.

    I would suggest that you concentrate on self love and acceptance and eventually the Universe will give you what you need...but not necessarily what you want.

    You may live in a relationship happily ever after, you may not. In my experience living who oneself is and not putting expectations on destiny when it arrives is the path to inner peace.
     
  4. Cyrus

    Cyrus Senior Registered

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    Hi, S&S:

    I'll answer to just a small part of your message, namely, to "why it seems axiomatic to...".
    IMHO, just why it seems axiomatic to ME (well, really, not so axiomatic, but fairly convincing, maybe).
    There are members on this forum, who can remember their PLs much better than you and I can, and who narrated here about having been incarnated alternatevely into men and women, without any residual hysteresis effect.

    For me it's quite sufficient.

    Best regards.
     
  5. tanker

    tanker Senior Registered

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    I'm glad if my experiences have helped you in any way. I certainly find nothing in my innate sexuality that could be thought of as a punishment or a lesson, as I'm very content with it. I'm no longer going to be commenting publicly on this thread, but I'm more than happy to offer support on PM any time, if you feel it would be helpful. Wishing you all the very best in finding a way to live a happier life.
     
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  6. SeaAndSky

    SeaAndSky Senior Registered

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    Hi Cyrus,

    This board represents a fairly limited data set. Here is a larger data compilation for analysis:

    https://psi-encyclopedia.spr.ac.uk/articles/reincarnation-cases-sex-change

    I am not vouching for the source overall, as I have not sought to review other issues it covers. However, this seems to be a fairly succinct but thorough compilation and analysis of existing data from serious researchers. From my standpoint, it leaves many issues unresolved, but that is probably to be expected at this stage of research. I also don't see that it definitively resolves the issue we have been discussing, but I'll be interested in your thoughts and reactions after review.

    Cordially,
    S&S
     
  7. Cyrus

    Cyrus Senior Registered

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    Hi, S&S:

    I'm really confused:

    I thought we were talking of whether the souls (spirits) have gender or not.

    But in this last article of yours they talk about the residual influence of a PL gender of a re-incarnated individual on his/her behaviour in a new life, when the gender changes.
    I, more or less agree on this with your article, but the starting point idea was not that.

    Two different scenarios may arise:

    1. Souls have genders, and a male soul gets re-incarnated into a female, or vice-versa.
    2. Souls have no genders, and a soul, previously incarnated into a male, this time incarnates into a female, or vice-versa.

    Regards.
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2020
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  8. SeaAndSky

    SeaAndSky Senior Registered

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    Hi Cyrus,

    I provided the cite as I thought you might appreciate a more thorough treatment on some of the issues related to cross-gender reincarnation.

    As you say, the two possibilities are Souls have gender or they do not. I don't think we'll be able to get any farther than that in our discussion at this time, so best to let it be for the time being.

    Cordially,
    S&S
     
  9. Polaris8

    Polaris8 Senior Registered

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    S&S, Interesting observations. I believe that the reason why we still retain our gender on the astral plane after death is because first it is the next dimension just beyond the physical where emotional awareness takes place plus the astral body being made of much finer matter than the physical tends to mold itself to the heavier physical frame work and form of the physical body along with the persons mindset and personality during the last incarnation. However the higher we go in dimensions the less matter there is presence and the more spiritual substances there is manifesting itself. Once soul reaches the casual or soul plane all lower matter is dropped completely and the soul returns to its natural spiritual state of being in its purest form.

    Many don't realize that when we are incarnated into the physical most of what is being manifested here is mostly physical matter with the lower ego largely in control of the show since it is dealing with the lower mind with very little spiritual substance getting thru to have experience here. Its not much but enough for the soul to have its experience here. However without the presences of the soul manifesting itself thru matter, matter can not hold itself together for long and will fall apart. In which case it will return to the natural elements of the earth plane. This is why when we die and the soul withdraws from the heavy physical body as the silver cord snaps the physical body as a whole starts to fall apart. It is no longer alive as a whole unit anymore but its individual cells still live on for awhile until they too return to the earth to feed and nourish planets and animal ect.. The soul has simply shifted its full awareness now in the astral body where it will continue to live on as before except now its full conscious awareness is on the astral now. This goes for all life be it man, animal, planets, ect... As all things are apart of spirit itself.

    Peace and love to you always.

    P.
     
  10. Polaris8

    Polaris8 Senior Registered

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    SheSearches, It does not matter if your gay, straight, bi, black, white, Asian, poor, rich, are of a different culture, religion, spiritual path or the many other things that make us different as individuals we are all still apart of divine love. For soul comes from the heart of god and divine love not sin. You are not a human that has a soul but a soul that is having a human experience. Always remember this my dear. Karma is not about punishment or reward. It's a tool to help the soul know itself thru trial and error. For soul is here so it may know itself by its own experience.

    Peace and love always.

    P.
     
  11. Speedwell

    Speedwell Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    I don't think those are the only possibilities.

    I look at things more broadly, some come into this life carrying intensely strong memories of previous life/lives, while others are seemingly unaware of any past (though research suggests most people do have some previous existence, it is more a case of not being able to remember).

    Given the huge variability in people's recall, whether conscious or buried but manifesting in other ways such as trauma having no present-life cause, it seems to me that one cannot say very much about what is our 'true' nature. Personally I feel it is going beyond what we can know, to make definitive assertions about what are the available list of possibilities.
     
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  12. SeaAndSky

    SeaAndSky Senior Registered

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    Hi Speedwell,

    One reason I stopped pursuing the matter is that I realized that the question of soul gender inevitably involves the question of "origins"--where/what we came from? I also think it will inevitably involve the other "biggies"--where/what we (as soul/spirit) are going towards, and why? At this point, the proposed answers to all of these questions all appear to lie in the religious and philosophical domains. The scientific study of reincarnation and supporting realities (such as the nature of whatever immaterial "something" reincarnates) has barely gotten off of the ground, much less progressed to any coherent understanding of the "big" questions. In terms of science we might find common ground for agreement. In terms of religion and philosophy, the chances are minimal. It's fun to consider the possibilities sometimes, but probably better done on a thread dedicated to that purpose.

    Cordially,
    S&S

    PS--Nonetheless, and perhaps because very little is clear in these matters, I believe we are entitled to our respective opinions on all of the foregoing matters, including soul gender.
     
  13. Klaud

    Klaud Senior Member

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    First of all, I'm sorry this is so hard for you and that you feel you don't have any support.

    You chose this path for a reason. Why do you think that is? That's not a snarky question, but really think about it. What can you take from all this? The real lesson here may be somewhat removed from your sexual orientation.

    Personally, I think we fall in love with a soul and not a body/society's idea of what constitutes as male or female. Human constructs often cloud our judgement.

    We can only be who we are. Who that person is is up to you.
     
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  14. Cyrus

    Cyrus Senior Registered

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    Come on, Klaud,

    If this were true, then the planet Earth would get depopulated long long ago, because the souls here live IN the bodies, and the bodies are mortal and have to pro-create.

    Love is only a by-product of the biological instinct of pro-creation, to help us to choose a partner best suited to produce the fittest new organism with.

    This self-perpetuation instinct has undergone millenia of evolution, but, like a complex computer program, may still have certain errors (bugs), affecting the body's sexual orientation.

    A soul may be offered a physical body with such a bug to re-incarnate into, for some reasons that we ignore.

    IMHO.

    Best regards.
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2020
  15. Ajay0

    Ajay0 Active Member

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    I apologize for the perceived offense. Here in India, I have not yet come in contact with homosexuals to understand them better. I have come across two bisexuals who now pursue a heterosexual lifestyle.There are transgender people called Hijra's in Indian language, who are believed to have the power to confer blessings on people during childbirth and weddings, and it is considered inaupicious to offend them or cause them misery.

    The viewpoint suggested is that social and religious conditioning may have something to do with homosexuality, and it is for expressing this view that I put this post here. Apologizing again for any hurt feelings or sentiments and expressing my deepest well-wishes of peace and prosperity .
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2020
  16. fireflydancing

    fireflydancing just a fly in the sky Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Note from moderator: after a complaint of a member of the forum, the original post of AjayO was pulled and under admin review.
     
  17. tanker

    tanker Senior Registered

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    AjayO, thank you for your kind apology. I really appreciate that. I realise that the quotation you chose as an illustration is from a source that clearly has no understanding of the subject! Sending all good wishes to you also.
     
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  18. Jim78

    Jim78 Senior Registered

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    I've said it before and I'll say it again. An excellent summation of Humanist viewpoints that I think has broader meaning for all life:

    The Vulcan IDIC: Infinite Diversity In Infinite Combinations:

    The glory of creation is in its infinite diversity and in how our differences combine to create meaning and beauty.

    I personally don't believe based on my experiences that the source, the creator, universal consciousness....whatever, creates errors or bugs. IMO there is no such thing as coincidence.

    It is very possible that the presence of differing sexualities, genders, races, cultures etc exist in this world to teach us, as a species, to eventually accept and celebrate diversity.

    What differences teach on a personal level is probably individual IMO.

    Also if we go back to thinking and treating differing sexuality as a disease to be treated IMO we risk returning to the barbarism that occurred in Europe just over three quarters of a century ago.

    I posted originally on the thread because I didn't like the direction it was headed in and I personally believe that embracing diversity does not mean having the freedom to foster bigoted viewpoints.

    Just saying...look at the OPs name...SheSearches. We are supposed to be encouraging her to embrace her differences not condemn her with overly intellectualised and non empathic opinions nor with concepts that her uniqueness is somehow erroneous or diseased.

    Its careless, dangerous and unhelpful IMO. There is zero evidence of some kind of universal bugs or errors or of disease also. Why speculate away a new member who came here hoping for understanding?
     
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  19. Stewardess Ester Ősz

    Stewardess Ester Ősz Senior Member

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    Nothing is new under the sun. It has all happened before.

    The days of Lot. And labeling the bitter for sweet, and the sweet for bitter. The game of illusions.

    There is nothing to fear, for those who put their faith and their trust in the truth. Then the truth will shine for them and their souls, as a lamp for their feet as they walk through the darkest of ages.

    Sweet is sweet.
    And what is bitter is bitter.

    Never doupt it. Trust the truth, and not the illusion. Every day, every hour, every minute and for every breathtake of your life, the truth shall set you free.
     
  20. Cyrus

    Cyrus Senior Registered

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    Oh, tanker,

    Please, don't overrate the importance of my insignificant opinion.

    I learnt it from my biology teacher at school. Besides teaching, she also worked as a researcher in a genetics laboratory.

    And I guess the most scientists have the same or similar opinion, too, poor devils. IMHO.

    Regards.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2020
  21. Klaud

    Klaud Senior Member

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    So many of our predecessors had to hide their sexuality away and ~conform~ because being gay or whatever they were wouldn't have been acceptable in their time.

    Again, human constructs/ideas can cloud our judgement, which is something very apparent in this thread. It's not that sexual orientation doesn't have merit when we're in a body, but that's an extremely minor detail in the soul's path and it basically becomes irrelevant when we're not in a body anymore.

    I'm not convinced there is a bug. We love who we love and should be able to do so free of judgement and shame.

    I have to respectfully disagree with your take on love being a by product. That's a very clinical way to look at it imo. Love really knows no bounds.
     
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  22. Jim78

    Jim78 Senior Registered

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    I agree with you Klaud.

    If love is merely a biological construct for procreation then why did I encounter my past life fiance and love her just as intensely in my current life?

    If its simply biology then how does Cyrus explain it biologically, as we were both in different biological bodies to our past lives?

    IMO love is universal and its not for others to judge.
     
  23. Bellona324

    Bellona324 Divine Femboy

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    Hoo boy, I’m sorry about your experiences. Well just know that you’re valid no matter what and we’re getting more and more accepting to the point that even I am questioning my own sexuality sometimes. I’m mostly straight but I recognise that I’m not 100% hetero. Maybe 80%.

    I’m not here as often as I used to but you have my support and this is coming from a dead Nazi. I’ve learnt my lesson to be more accepting.
     
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  24. SeaAndSky

    SeaAndSky Senior Registered

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    Hmm. Just checking back on this ongoing debate. It seems to me that no one, including myself, has budged an inch from their initial positions since this discussion began. This subject has come up numerous times before, with the same result--if memory serves me. Sometimes it is best to just admit that an impasse has been reached and move on.
     
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  25. Reincarnat

    Reincarnat Member

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    You are absolutely right! I can relate to it because we are on the same boat.
     
  26. There and back again

    There and back again Senior Member

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    I believe that the root of the issue is that most are still all in when it comes to duality and gender being one of them after all this world is built on it to the extreme. I used to think that with the knowledge of reincarnation and other lives would resolve this issue where there is some universality where there is common ground of having been through such but clearly people still got a long road ahead of them.
     
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  27. SeaAndSky

    SeaAndSky Senior Registered

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    Hi TABA,

    I agree in terms of the basic issue, but not in terms of your position on the matter. I'm not trying to diss your opinion, just stating my disagreement.

    Duality is a fact here in the physical, and I like the interplay of Yin/Yang, darkness/light, etc. etc. So, I am definitely not anti-duality, it is what makes many or most of the beauty and wonders of existence in the physical possible (at least to me). The real question is, so to speak, how far duality goes beyond the physical and what beyond the physical continues to manifest non-physical aspects of the type of yin/yang--feminine/masculine duality we see in the physical.

    Polaris seems to be OK with this type of duality in the Astral, but sees it disappearing at higher levels. OTOH, I see gender duality as merely being expressed in other ways and/or being present but latent (rather than manifest) at higher levels. I'm not sure where others stand on this issue, though most seem to prefer a non-gendered spirit/soul. When it comes to same-gender sexual attractions, the conversation really gets muddled, and usually a great deal more problematic and contentious.

    Actually, it seems to me that the last issue is the unspoken determinant for many folks giving opinions in this area. Consequently, to me at least, this whole subject area has become a "tail wagging the dog" situation.

    However, I don't know how to get rid of the question. Can gender and gender attraction be discussed without taking into account same-gender attraction? I think it is possible, though the answer to this seems to be a resounding NO! based on what I see on this thread. That is unfortunate from my standpoint. Likewise, I hate to see discussion of the basic issue of soul/spirit gender being dominated by the issue of sexual attraction in the physical.

    Anyhow, I'm not casting aspersions in terms of anyone's opinions on the soul/spirit gender issue, but I do wish it was possible to have a discussion that didn't end up getting side-tracked and ending in a muddle.

    Cordially,
    S&S
     
  28. fireflydancing

    fireflydancing just a fly in the sky Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Hi S&S,

    I do remember that once you wrote about you being female in a former life. You were a lady in the occult circles. I remember a picture of her. It strikes me that you don't mention this anymore. Did you change your mind or did it become a kind of embarrassing feeling? Could it be possible that because of some gender confusion, you try to draw strict borders?
    Hey, I know these feelings. It's a bit of a twisted throwback from a past life experiencing living in the body of the opposite sex.
    The confusion and psychic tension can become so great that you can turn away from the experience, instead of incorporating its interesting lessons.
     
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  29. SeaAndSky

    SeaAndSky Senior Registered

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    Hi Firefly,

    Good question! No, I haven't rejected that putative PL, nor have I rejected at least one more that also seems to have been female (though I wish I could get more/clearer memories on both). I also am OK with being (as a current male) one of the occasional cross-gendered manifestations of an otherwise "feminine" soul/spirit! Those are issues I worked through some years back, though the whole idea was quite a shock at the time. :confused::eek:o_O;)

    As you can see from my included emojis, this was a bit of a surprise--but in the end, what the heck! As Popeye the Sailor says: I Yam what I Yam and that's all that I Yam! If a feminine gendered soul/spirit is what I "ultimately" am, I'm OK with that. :) And, no need to freak out either way. :cool:

    In any case, my basic reasons for sticking with the "gendered" soul idea are: (1) statistical; and (2) philosophical/religious. On (1), I think the PL data to date supports this hypothesis. On (2), I have done a lot of reading from a very wide variety of sources over the years. The idea of a gendered soul/spirit is certainly not something out of the blue. Actually, I think that most Western sources (at least) support this idea. Plus, I like it myself on a personal level. I'd discount the last if I thought (1) and/or (2) were less supportive, but for me, existence seems more comfortable and comfortably human from this perspective. Here I am not just talking about soul gender, but about the whole wonderful dualistic M/F and Yin/Yang creation that we inhabit. :D I like the universe that way and it just makes sense to me. :rolleyes:

    Cordially,
    S&S

    PS--Every so often I just have to let out those inner emojis!
     
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  30. SeaAndSky

    SeaAndSky Senior Registered

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    Hi Firefly,

    As a quick follow-up, I also have another female lifetime that I suspect was mine. This suspicion is not based on tangible memories, but on an extremely strong emotional response to this historical personage when I discovered her existence. (She is somewhat famous-or infamous--in France, but I was not familiar with her as an American).

    I was informed early on (in learning about PLs) that extreme emotional responses and feelings--with no current life explanation--were one of the signs of a PL. In this case, surprisingly enough, my response was not one of excitement, but of very extreme and deep chagrin/embarrassment. Insofar as chagrin/embarrassment is an emotion based on one's past personal actions and idiocies this "she" also might have been "me". However, I suppose it is also possible that "she" was just someone I was very close to. In any case, the PLs I have come up with so far (or even have an intuition or reaction to) in the PL field tend to be female--which was surprising to me at first. Now, not so much. My ability to adjust to the idea and take it in stride after an initial shock may also indicate something. o_O

    Cordially,
    S&S

    PS--My embarrassment was not due to her gender, but due to the fairly wild actions and history of this person. There is a lot in her that I admire and even identify with, but her behavior was pretty abysmal. Sheesh, I feel embarrassed just thinking about it.
     
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