Does the location of your death influence your next reincarnation?

Discussion in 'Reincarnation Questions' started by TheSeeker, Oct 23, 2017.

  1. GuySittingintheStands

    GuySittingintheStands Member

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    So Seeker's original question was a little more involved than he/she suspected. Misty is right, of course, emotional attachment to certain people or a certain person in a particular place can influence where a deceased person (DP) eventually reincarnates. This goes to the Why question: Why do DPs reincarnate where they do, what are the factors that influence / determine where a DP reincarnates. I was a little more concerned with the How question: How do DPs reincarnate where they do, what conditions must be met before a DP reincarnates where they do. Does length of time between reincarnations play a role?

    I don't think there was any prior emotional attachment between DP James Huston and the Leiningers when he spotted them on Waikiki Beach, Oahu, Hawaii, although it would be impossible to know for sure. But I don't think there was. Ditto for DP Marty Martin and the Hammons, in Muskogee (County), Oklahoma. Really hard to see a connection there.

    I've been thinking about that other now recently famous (or notorious, depending on your opinion) case, namely, the case of Christian Haupt and his mother's claim that he was/ is the reincarnation of Lou Gehrig. I know autumnleaves would give this case a 2 or 3 on the credibility scale, but I would give it a much higher score, say 6 or 7, based on Carol Bowman's first-hand testimony regarding her early phone interactions with the mother (Cathy Byrd) and the weird "coincidences" surrounding the case (eg., ALS ice bucket challenge going on at the same time, Christian and Cathy being diverted to Tampa Bay and winding up winning a giant photo of Lou Gehrig at a TB Rays' ALS awareness day by lottery). As far as Seeker's original location question goes, this is a case where the DP and the reincarnate are separated by 3000 miles, the distance between NYC and LA, and about 67 years (Lou Gehrig died in 1941, Bronx, NYC, NY - Christian Haupt was born in 2008, presumably Thousand Oaks, CA, greater LA area). I don't think there was any prior personal or emotional attachment between Lou Gehrig and the Haupts (or between Christina "Mom" Gehrig, d. 1954 Milford, Connecticut, and Cathy Byrd (b. 1967, LA metro area or greater LA area), if you believe her claim of being the reincarnate of Mom Gehrig). I'm still concerned with the "How" part of the question, but it may also involve the "Why" part of the question in this case (as in Why do DPs reincarnate where they do?), even though it would be wild speculation on my part. If anyone cares to join me down the rabbit hole for a couple of paragraphs, stay tuned. My speculation revolves around the filming of The Pride of Yankees in 1942,(released by Samuel Goldwyn Productions in July 1942), where it was filmed (NYC and LA), who starred in it (Gary Cooper and Teresa Wright), and Lou Gehrig's widow, Eleanor Twitchell Gehrig (d. 1984, NYC).
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2017
  2. KenJ

    KenJ Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Guy, I have no direct knowledge of the answer, but my thought would be that they where born where a member of their soul-group would be located (which is why I did not have a problem with Cathy's claim of being Lou's Mom). The concept of planning your life with others before being incarnated seems to be accepted by a majority of people, and it seems sensible to me.

    Your question is at the opposite end of life from the one that has often perplexed me - how did all those people agree to die at the same time as in the atomic blasts in Japan, or the mass of humanity in the prison camps in WWII, or even in the Twin Towers in NY City, those are the things that have led me to question both the "planning" and the whole concept of reincarnation at times.
     
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  3. kmatjhwy

    kmatjhwy Senior Member Staff Member

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    Now such an interesting question which am still pondering. As for myself have read Ian Stevenson's books and know about his thoughts on this matter. And interesting reading the replies here.

    As for myself and this question, is not about where I died in the last life but several past lives previously and where I was born in this life. Now in three different past life regressions, I saw myself as a Cheyenne Native American Woman with two kids which died at the Sand Creek Massacre in eastern Colorado in 1864. In this present life, I was born in Denver, Colorado in 1956. But it seems there could have been several lives in between this in other various locations. But still I find these two lives with where I died previously as a Cheyenne Woman and where I was born in this life interesting.

    For whatever it might be worth. Wishing Everyone the Best!
     
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2017
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  4. GuySittingintheStands

    GuySittingintheStands Member

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    Ken, didn't mean to imply that I am completely sold on the idea of reincarnation. I'm just a regular guy looking for answers like a lot of other folks that visit this forum. That said, you'll have to admit that it's a pretty good explanation of some otherwise unexplainable observations. It just needs to be fleshed out (if you'll pardon the pun). I think most people who visit this forum would agree, however, we do survive physical death, in some form or another, despite the prevailing materialistic worldview. Your criticism of the popular idea (in some circles) that deceased persons (DPs) "choose" who they come back as, knowing what the next incarnation holds in store for them, is certainly valid. A commentor in reference to the Daily Mail online write-up/ review of Cathy Byrd's book raised the same objection: Who would want to come back into an impoverished and perhaps abusive family (Nobody!) and yet babies are born into impoverished and abusive families all the time. But maybe they (DPs), just like us, even having access to a lot more information about the future than we have on this side, still aren't provided with all the details of their future lives, just like we aren't provided with insights into our own future on this side. We see through a glass darkly. Maybe they do as well.

    Anyway, just wanted to add a little interim follow-up to my comments re the location question as it pertains to the Christian Haupt story. If you read and enjoyed Cathy Byrd's book, I would recommend watching The Pride of the Yankees (Samuel Goldwyn Productions, released July, 1942, about a year after Lou Gehrig's tragic death in June 1941. Its on youtube). (For those of you who did not grow up in this country (USA), Lou Gehrig was a very famous American baseball player and perhaps the most inspirational athlete in American sports history, loved and admired by tens of millions of Americans for almost 80 years now, which perhaps makes it especially hard for people to believe that he came back as a little boy into a middle-class family in Thousand Oaks, California in 2008).

    After Ken, and Cathy Byrd's claim to have been Mom Gehrig, you'd think that Lou simply followed his mother out to Los Angeles, somehow or another. (Begs the question of how she got out there, though). But did he really follow her out to California, or did she, Lou's mother (post-mortem) follow him out to the West Coast, or was there some sort of soul group discussion thing going on? My idea is this: What if Lou Gehrig was in Hollywood for the making of The Pride of the Yankees, at least in spirit (literally). Four of his New York Yankee teammates appeared in the movie including the slimmed down Bambino himself, as himself, Babe Ruth. What if Lou followed them all out to Hollywood much as James Huston followed his squad back to Pearl Harbor, Honolulu, Hawaii. Would have been another road trip for Lou, his last, at least as Lou Gehrig.
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2017
  5. GuySittingintheStands

    GuySittingintheStands Member

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    Just a quick something to think about item while I am down here in the rabbit hole researching the making of The Pride of the Yankees and any possible connection to Lou Gehrig's post-mortem whereabouts circa 1941-1942, and indeed, any possible connection to Cathy Byrd herself and Thousand Oaks, California.

    Sticklers for accuracy will note that I wrote that James Leininger was conceived in Honolulu, Hawaii, after spotting his future parents at a hotel on Waikiki Beach. In fact, in Bruce and Andrea's book Soul Survivor it clearly says that James was conceived 5 weeks after little James Leininger claimed to have spotted his future parents having dinner at the very hotel they were staying at on Waikiki Beach that summer (1997). I'm not sure if Andrea meant to say that she found out she was pregnant with James 5 weeks after that dinner engagement, or that James was, in fact, conceived 5 weeks after Bruce and Andrea's dinner at the Royal Hawaiian, which is where little James correctly describes spotting them, shortly before Andrea became pregnant with him.

    Here's why it might matter viz a viz reincarnation studies. Let's say Andrea got it right in the book, namely that her son James was conceived 5 weeks after the Leininger's dinner that evening on Waikiki Beach. How does James, still not even a glimmer in his future father's eye, get from Honolulu to Dallas? First-class or coach?
    Tell me it doesn't work like that. Go ahead.

    Am coming up with interesting bits of data re the making of The Pride of the Yankees movie but still no "That's odd" anecdotes, at least not in any of the newspaper accounts of the day. Maybe there will be something in the recent Richard Sandomir book of the same title, but even if there is nothing really creepy, there's enough there to speculate that it would have been even stranger had Lou not been in Los Angeles for a movie featuring 4 of his old teammates from the Yankees' 1927 team "Murderers Row", including his best team friend and roommate for 14 seasons, catcher Bill Dickey, and, of course, the most emotionally-charged moments of his life, and indeed, the most emotionally-charged moment in American sports history, the impromtu "Luckiest Man" speech Lou gave on Lou Gehrig Day, Yankee Stadium, July 4, 1939. Apparently, according to newspaper accounts of the day, Gary Cooper's re-creation of that scene was so realistic, so moving, that it was as memorable as Lou Gehrig's original few words of appreciation nearly 3 years before. For a brief moment in time, Gary Cooper became Lou Gehrig.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2017
  6. GuySittingintheStands

    GuySittingintheStands Member

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    In Jan 1938 during the baseball off-season 20thCentury-Fox brought NY Yankee superstar first baseman Lou Gehrig out to Los Angeles to see how he'd do in the movies. The result was a cowboy western called "Rawhide" (released by 20thCentury Fox, Apr 1938) in which Lou plays himself, co-starring Smith Ballew, the singing cowboy. The movie is available on youtube. If you watch the movie (and I highly recommend that you do since it is pertinent to the location question) it really looks like Lou is having the time of his life even though he'd never been on a horse before. Never have you seen a guy having as much fun in a movie as Lou does in this one, and for a complete amateur, he's actually not bad, even credible. But there's more.

    A ton of films were shot in the western San Fernando Valley area, especially westerns, as they took advantage of the then open hill country of Conejo Valley, just west and immediately adjacent to the San Fernando Valley. TV westerns that were shot in Conejo Valley include The Rifleman, Gunsmoke, and Bonanza. You get the idea. The Jan 24, 1938 edition of the the LA Times reported that "Final and lasting proof that 'Two-gun Lou' . . . is composed of durable stuff took place last week when he started filming "Rawhide" on location in the San Fernando Valley. . . . [said Gehrig:] 'This is more fun than winning a World Series' said Two Gun the other evening after he'd just finished another day on the range. 'They're sure a great bunch to work with, from Director Ray Taylor, Evalyn Knapp [who plays Lou's fictional sister, Peggy Gehrig, in the movie], and Smith Bellew on down to the extras. They all go out of their way to help me.' . . ."

    Another article mentions that the shooting location was "half-an-hour from Hollywood Boulevard". (although I'm sure some of the town and indoor shots were filmed at 20th Century's studios and backlot in what would become Century City, just southwest of Beverly Hills). A half-an-hour from Hollywood Boulevard in 1938 puts you in the western San Fernando Valley. What else is in the western San Fernando Valley area, in the Conejo Valley? Thousand Oaks, California, presumably the hometown of Cathy Byrd, author of The Boy Who Knew Too Much, the story of how Cathy Byrd discovered that her toddler son was the reincarnation of Lou Gehrig.

    An incomplete list of films that were shot in Thousand Oaks, California appears online (Wikipedia "List of Films Shot in Thousand Oaks") which doesn't include 20th Century's obscure B-film "Rawhide" (1938), but maybe it should. I'll keep digging.

    There's even another connection between Lou Gehrig and Conejo Valley / western San Fernando Valley area of southern California. Teresa Wright, the rising young Hollywood starlet who plays Lou Gehrig's wife, Mrs. Eleanor Twitchell Gehrig ("Ellie") in The Pride of the Yankees (released by Samuel Goldwyn Productions/ RKO distributors, 1942 about a year after Gehrig's tragic death in NYC from ALS), married Hollywood film writer and story editor, Niven Busch in late May 1942, just after production and shortly before The Pride of the Yankees was released. Teresa Wright and Niven Busch, just after a 10-day honeymoon up the Calif coast, moved into Niven's sister's home in Van Nuys, Calif (Western San Fernando Valley), in June 1942. They would move into their own home in the hill country above Encino in 1944 , in the western San Fernando Valley, about 10 miles east of what would become Thousand Oaks, California in the mid-1950s (incorporated 1964). They made their home there for 10 years (until their divorce in 1952) raising their two children, a son (b. 1944) and a daughter (b. 1947) and two sons of Niven Busch from a previous marriage.

    Enough for now, hopefully more later, once I get Richard Sandomir's 2017 "The Pride of the Yankees" book in.
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2017
  7. GuySittingintheStands

    GuySittingintheStands Member

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    Before I get to Richard Sandomir's 2017 "The Pride of the Yankees" which I have now finished, I'd like to turn Seeker's question around, in order to compare his original scenario to the more familiar terrestrial scenario: If someone is born somewhere (say a foreign country, as in Seeker's question), does that influence where that someone dies? This is the exact opposite of Seeker's question, but I think you see the analogy here. The answer is, of course, it depends. It depends on a lot of things including the decision's one's parents make, decisions a person makes as one matures, physical circumstances, historical circumstances, emotional circumstances (marriage, who one marries, what one decides to do with ones life as much as it depends on him/her) etc. Analogously for the reincarnation of deceased persons (DPs) where one is re-born may depend on a myriad of factors, similar to ones in life on this side. Time may also be a factor. As life progresses the chances of staying in one locality decrease. Similarly as time after death progresses, the chances of staying in one locality decrease. Doesn't rule out being born in the same locality that one died in after a number of years, but it does provide an explanation for not being re-born in the same area after 1, 10, 20, 30, 50, or 100 years: DPs simply get up and leave for whatever reason. That is, unless, you believe that DPs can magically pop in and out wherever they want to or are needed, sort of like Barbara Eden in I Dream of Jeannie, or find their future parents in a crystal ball or something equivalent from the other side.

    All that aside, I have been focusing on the factor(s) necessary for a DP to reincarnate where he/ she does. I'm suggesting that there may be a locality condition (or constraint, the more technical term): DPs gotta show up somewhere in the general vicinity of their future parent(s), before he/she hooks up with them. Sounds crazy, I know, but look at the case of Christian Haupt (assuming you score this one high enough on the credibility scale). He claims to have spotted his future mother at her birth and "then she got old" (ie, old enough to become pregnant with him; Christian was born in 2008). His mother, Cathy Byrd, was born in 1967, probably in southeastern Thousand Oaks (Westlake Village, since she went to Westlake HS), in any event, definitely within the Los Angeles county limits near the western San Fernando Valley area of southern California. Possibly Agoura or Agoura Hills just up the road (Ventura Freeway) which would make it even closer to Encino, the former home of Niven and Teresa Wright 1942-1952. Can we connect Lou Gehrig, who died in the Riverdale section of the Bronx, New York City, June 2, 1941, to Thousand Oaks, California, (at or near where Cathy Byrd and Christian Haupt (her son) were born), anytime after June 1941? Obviously this is a silly question, or a little more seriously, an impossible problem, impossible to solve because the dead don't exactly make themselves known or leave a trail, at least in the physical sense. But are there enough coincidences or "coincidences" perhaps with enough emotionally-motivated handwaving arguments to at least make a case for their whereabouts after death? Maybe. Maybe not.

    Because the case of Christian Haupt involves a famous and more or less recently deceased person (Lou Gehrig) one can follow the characters involved through contemporaneous newspaper accounts, biographies, first-hand accounts, interviews, etc. Within 6 weeks of Lou Gehrig's death, his widow, Eleanor Twitchell Gehrig, had signed a contract with Hollywood's Samuel Goldwyn (formerly the "G" in MGM) (studio, company, productions) to make a movie about her husband's life and career with the New York Yankees. Eleanor Gehrig would become the chief consultant for the initial screen story and the film would naturally contain all of the most emotionally charged moments in Lou's tragically short life (he died of ALS, "Lou Gehrig's Disease", June 2, 1941, days before his 38th birthday, in the prime of his career if not his life, about 2 years after being diagnosed), including his almost 8 year marriage to Ellie, the love of his life. According to strict instructions from Samuel Goldwyn, the film was to be a classic love story with some baseball thrown in for authenticity and to make the fans happy, not the other way around. It became one of the biggest box office hits in 1942, nominated for 11 Academy Awards, and immortalized Lou Gehrig (and Gary Cooper, who plays him) and his "Luckiest man on the face of the earth" farewell speech given 2 weeks after he was diagnosed with a terminal and irreversible neurological disease (ALS).

    Would Lou have really cared about how a movie about his life turned out? I think so. Especially since the love of his life, his wife, Eleanor Gehrig, was pouring her heart and soul into the script. I think he would have cared, and cared a great deal. For those of you that believe DPs have some foreknowledge of who their future parents will be, he also had to find a way to get out to Los Angeles, somehow. I had three candidates for getting Lou out to LA for the film's production (Feb - May 1942): former teammate Babe Ruth, who plays himself in the movie, Yankee catcher Bill Dickey, his closest team friend and roommate for 14 seasons with the Yankees, and, of course, Eleanor Gehrig, herself, the obvious choice. Dickey was out because he would have had to have started out from his home in Arkansas, and the Babe was probably not the best of candidates as, prior to Lou's farewell address to the fans, had not been on speaking terms with Lou for several years (even despite Ruth's near collapse and tearful breakdown immediately after viewing Lou's dead body lying "in state" in the Bronx). Lou had to have followed Ellie out to Los Angeles. No doubt about it. But why? And how does he wind up in the Thousand Oaks, California area? I'll try to make the case in the coming posts.
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2017
  8. GuySittingintheStands

    GuySittingintheStands Member

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    Lou Gehrig died June 2, 1941 in the Riverdale (Hudson River side) section of the Bronx, NYC, New York. Within 3 weeks of his death, Hollywood movie moguls and fans alike wondered out loud whether a movie about the storied superstar first baseman for the NY Yankees and his tragic death would make a great inspirational movie, not to mention be worth box office gold. Samuel Goldwyn, who was born in Poland and grew up in England before moving to Los Angeles to become one of Hollywood's biggest movie moguls, had no interest in baseball let alone making a likely box office "baseball movie" bomb. However, one of his story editors, a New York native and former New York sports writer, who had done an in-depth face-to-face interview with Gehrig during the 1929 baseball season, before moving out to Hollywood in 1933, was convinced that a movie about Lou Gehrig's life, career, and tragic death would make a great movie, box office gold or no. His name was Niven Busch. Busch showed his boss Samuel Goldwyn newsreel clips of Lou giving his July 4, 1939 farewell to baseball address. Goldwyn, an immigrant himself who also got his start washing dishes, was moved. Busch showed him the clips a second time. Goldwyn was reduced to tears. Goldwyn immediately turned to his top advisor, James Mulvey and had him call the Gehrigs' agent in New York that afternoon for contract negotiations. By early July 1941 Eleanor had agreed to a contract with the Goldwyn company for a film about Lou's life and career. Eleanor was given final veto authority over every aspect of the film, and would be hired as chief consultant for the draft story scripts as well as principle technical adviser. Shortly thereafter, sometime in mid- July 1941 she was on her way out to Los Angeles from New York by train to sign the contract bringing with her two large scrapbooks covering her life with Lou, Lou's career, and what's more -- her memories of an 8-year rollercoaster marriage to an American sports legend and the love of her life. Hollywood was familiar territory for Eleanor Gehrig. She and Lou had been out to LA 3 and a half years earlier in Jan 1938 for several weeks to make an admittedly corny but endearing cowboy movie starring Lou as himself shot in the open hill country of Thousand Oaks, California just north of Hollywood (Rawhide, 20thCentury Fox, 1938). Lou loved the whole experience. Eleanor stayed in California the rest of the summer, working with Goldwyn story and script writer Paul Gallico for almost 4 straight weeks to get an initial draft story down on paper. Afterwards Eleanor returned home to NYC to wait for casting announcements.

    Eleanor mentioned that Lou's favorite actor was Gary Cooper, but she preferred Spencer Tracy to play the part. As for herself, she thought Barbara Stanwyck might be a good choice to play her, but she had no strong preferences. Goldwyn, who still had one of Hollywood's top box office draws, Gary Cooper, for one more movie, also had one of Hollywood's fastest rising young stars, a pretty 23-year old actress named Teresa Wright, under contract. Gary Cooper, a native Montanan, had never played baseball and Teresa Wright, a native New Yorker who grew up in Maplewood, New Jersey, had no interest in baseball. The two of them were naturally reluctant but went ahead and signed on to the film by early Jan 1942: Cooper to play Gehrig; Wright to play Lou's wife, Eleanor Gehrig. Goldwyn had ordered a love story crafted around Lou's baseball career, and a love story he got. Gallico's original script underwent several major re-writes, and dozens and dozens of minor editing changes by Goldwyn's main screenwriters Herman Mankiewicz and Jo Swerling not to mention a small legion of other Goldwyn writers and the occasional sportswriter. Eleanor's venomous relationship with her mother-in-law, the overly possessive Mom Gehrig was toned down considerably. The character of Eleanor herself, in life a tough 36-year old former society girl from money who came of age in the backroom speakeasies of roaring 20s Chicago, was softened and sweetened up unapologetically. Teresa Wright's character was to be an ideal version of Eleanor Gehrig, a change that Eleanor agreed to, and in the end came to admire. There was no doubt that Lou himself would have approved.

    Oh, forgot to mention that Teresa Wright (b. 1918), the daughter of a NYC prostitute and a well-to-do NYC insurance agent, was born and spent her early childhood in Harlem, Manhattan, NYC, less than a mile from where Lou Gehrig (b. 1903) was born and grew up in the Yorkville tenement and Washington Heights sections of Manhattan, before matriculating at Columbia University in uptown Manhattan. Also forgot to mention that Lou as part of his baseball career, traveled extensively, even taking a barnstorming and goodwill trip in 1934 to Japan with Babe Ruth and his wife, Eleanor, and other major league ballplayers and their wives.

    Still much more to come, including an explanation for how Mom Gehrig (d. 1954 in Milford, Connecticut), post-mortem, gets out to Thousand Oaks, California by 1964. Also, because there are people reading this who grew up outside of this country (USA) and might not know who Lou Gehrig was, someone has put together a really short but touching 5 minute youtube clip entitled Lou Gehrig - The Iron Horse, complete with a little pacabel canon in D background music. Its pretty clear why Gehrig is considered baseball's first real power hitter, an athlete's athlete. Pay particular attention to 4.00 to 4.19 min into the clip. It's some footage of Lou on Lou Gehrig Appreciation Day, on a swelteringly hot July 4, 1939 afternoon between games of a doubleheader, Yankee Stadium in the Bronx just before he is coxed out to say a few words to a sardine-packed ballpark of 62,000 adoring fans who are going absolutely bananas over their shy, limelight-shunning hero and Yankee team captain. Head down, overcome with emotion, the big man, is seen choking back tears. I had never seen it before.
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2017
  9. Elisabeth of Hesse

    Elisabeth of Hesse Elisabeth

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    I died at the spala hunting lodge (belonging to Tsar Nicholas II) in Russia (now Poland) and I was reborn as a girl in Oregon with a nearly similar birthday as my previous life.
     
  10. MD14

    MD14 New Member

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    In my opinion, no. Unless your soul wants to go back there, then it would. But most likely it would choose somewhere else to incarnate.
     
  11. RedSunshine

    RedSunshine Member

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    No influence at all
     
  12. Angie Brown

    Angie Brown Senior Registered

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    I go by the premise that even if we know who and what we were before, we don't know who and what we may be in the future. It gives a perspective on race and culture prejudice against other individuals.
    That isn't to say that we should not be loyal to the race and culture of our current life, but that the loyalty shouldn't lead to hatred of other people based upon no more than they being of a different but normal race or culture.

    Not a specific answer, but a general one. From that I figure is that where we die and who and what as is unlikely to affect where we are maybe next born. Just imo.

    I hope that helps :)
     

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