Human senses and past incarnation memories

Discussion in 'Reincarnation Questions' started by John Tat, Jul 25, 2019.

  1. John Tat

    John Tat Senior Registered

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    During my most recent meditations BB my spiritual self has been communicating to me about the complex problems associated with past incarnation memories and the senses of the physical body.....
    Touch..Sight...Hearing...Smell..Taste and another I found "proprioception...the sense of how our physical brains understands where the physical body actually is
    All of these human/physical senses developed over millions of years of physical evolution
    The problem for our spiritual selves/souls is...all of these senses are physical senses not spiritual
    This brings about many problems... even with physical memory its impossible to record these senses to memory
    for example...we must smell a rose to remember what a rose smells... memory itself does not record the actual smell of the rose
    That is a basic example of what BB is communicating to me... the human brain must re experience the memory/ sense to remember it ...so where does that leave spiritual/soul memory? It's obvious it cannot pass on in memory what it cannot record
    just one other example...our brains are not recorders of sound that can be played back by the press of a button
    so sound along with the other senses is not recorded to memory... we can remember a tune but its not a recording of the actual song ... so are the actual sounds and the other senses associated with past incarnation memories a myth... a figment of our imaginations?
    The same could be asked about physical emotions
     
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  2. fireflydancing

    fireflydancing just a fly in the sky Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Interesting, I think we call it triggers. When you meet a situation alike, you can be thrown back in time in a second and remember and relive a certain event.
     
  3. SeaAndSky

    SeaAndSky Senior Registered

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    Hi John,

    This raises interesting questions. If the spiritual you cannot remember PL sense impressions until it has been experienced by a current physical body, what happens between incarnations? Is the spiritual you unable to remember what happened in prior lives in terms of the physical senses when no longer embodied? That doesn't make sense to me. This would mean that the spiritual you was basically unable to remember anything meaningful about past lives when disembodied. Maybe BB means that the current physical self--John Tat at the moment--is unable to tap into such PL sense memories from the spiritual self until they have been experienced in the new lifetime by the physical self? That would make more sense to me.

    However, since we learn how to use our senses pretty early in each lifetime, it seems that the only things that couldn't be remembered during childhood would be the sense experiences that are specific to adulthood. I can only think of one in that category = sex. Maybe the physical experience of childbirth would be another. But I'm just guessin'.

    Cordially,
    S&S
     
  4. KenJ

    KenJ Assistant Archivist and Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Surprising as it might seem S&S, sex is not an innate understanding. The Trobriand Island people are an example and I have been surprised to find people while counseling in their seventies with ignorance. I do think that the Rose example would be difficult to defend however.
     
  5. SeaAndSky

    SeaAndSky Senior Registered

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    Hi Ken,

    Not intending to offend John here, but there are a wide variety of things that BB says about the reincarnation process that I simply don't agree with. That should be no surprise, since there are many other things BB says that I don't agree with. I'm sure that BB likewise holds what I believe to be incorrect/inaccurate (and myself to be completely inconsequential--which he has affirmed). So, I suppose there is no love lost there in either direction. Still, BB has said some things of interest from time to time, so I keep listening. I'm sure my interest is not reciprocated, but I'm OK with that as well.

    Cordially,
    S&S
     
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  6. John Tat

    John Tat Senior Registered

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    HI S&S and Ken.. This thing about physical senses and emotions is part of a never ending education BB and my source puts John Tat through... this is a separate side s of both BB and my source which includes some things I have talked about including traveling within the light and multiple incarnation process's which as time goes by I get a better understanding off. This thing about human senses and emotions is something BB and my source wants me to understand but its very hard with most of my education.... Its like coming to understand that the world is not flat.. most of it ...if not all of it goes against what is now believed to be true,,, Its like I now understand the only way we will travel to the stars is in the vacuum of the light.. In other words for reasons I do not understand you can travel many times the speed of light within the vacuum of the light.. the thing is I have no clue if the science of today understands that there is a type of vacuum within the light and how to find it... That is a small part of what I do know through my education of how to travel within the light .. Any other research on how we will travel to he stars is a complete waste of time effort and money...there is only one way
    The point I'm trying to make ... if the science of today has no understanding of traveling within the light.. then it's impossible for anyone to understand how human senses and emotions works in the spiritual
    There are some things about it that through my education I do understand...The most important I think is... the spiritual us is not physical in any ways

    All The Best
     
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  7. KenJ

    KenJ Assistant Archivist and Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    I feel the same way and chalk it up to BB being a spirit that lived at that time with the "religious" beliefs of that period. I also agree with you that John's memories are of interest and should be respected as well as John himself for his participation.
     
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  8. Polaris8

    Polaris8 Senior Member

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    John Tat,

    You brought up a very good point. As triggers! can cause memories to surface to the conscious mind from either this lifetime or Past lives. Our past life memories are stored in the permanent atom of the soul body or what some may term the causal body. The causal /Soul Body is named "Causal" because it is the originating source of each new personality that reincarnates in each lifetime. It is the source of your manifested present personality, causing it to be and exist.

    When your present personality ends, the eternal essence of you is absorbed and goes inward into the next inner body which would be the astral. The physical is dropped and soul will then spend time on various levels of this dimension of reality until the same process occurs once again and soul drops the astral body and goes further inward into the mental body. Then after some time has been spent on the mental dimension soul will drop the mental body and finally return to full consciousness within the Soul/Casual Body which is the eternal part of you. The Soul Body is immortal as it exists beyond time space and matter during your soul journey through the many incarnations or lifetimes within the lower worlds of duality which are the physical, astral and mental dimensions.

    So each time we reincarnate we receive a new mental, astral and physical body which have no memory of these prior lifetimes. However the karmic actions from the past are carried over to later be expressed in the new lifetime. This is because the permanent memories and karmic actions of these other lifetimes are stored within the soul body itself. But since the new incarnated ego has no memory of this it will in essences get a clean slate each time. This process is how the soul/consciousness itself evolves. At least In my opinion.

    This is one of the reason why children have an easier time remembering their past lives is because their inner bodies are still developing along with their physical one. Having not yet lived in this world all that long allows them easier access to the connections within the soul body’s permanent atom and its memories of other lifetimes lived. As the child grows older this becomes less and less possible as the present personality is now taking hold and is more grounded into the physical world. In time these memories fade all together. In a way this is has it should. As nature is kind by not allowing us to normally have memories of these other lifetimes so as to prevent any harm it may cause both mentality and emotionally to the present personality now being lived.

    Now that being said this is where triggers do come into play here. During our present life all the experiences we have ever had are recorded first thru the physical brain, then thru the astral body, which are then passed on into mental body or what you might term the mind and then finally stored permanently within the causal body. ( which is the soul). When we die we have our life review as conscious experiences everything we ever did, felt, said, experience not only us but how our actions affected others in life as well. This is our higher self reviewing the life just lived and all those memories are now stored and added forever within the soul body. As our inner subtle bodies which correspond with the higher dimensions of our universe along with our physical one work together in unison as one unit while incarnated and have been evolving over millions of years just like the physical world does as well.

    So if something happens that triggers a memory be it good, bad or others wise it will be pulled actually from deep within either the unconscious mind which is the upper part of the mental body or the causal body itself. At that point those energy signatures of memory will then have to filter downwards in vibration thru all the inner subtle bodies until it reaches the physical brain itself which reacts on the surface of the brains neurons in order to register conscious awareness within the physical world. These memories can be literally anything be it sight, smell, sounds, emotions, or mental images all within an split second. Tigger's can be anything,. When I smell fresh cut grass I can remembered my childhood. However smelling rosemary reminds me of being back in the middles ages. Music is another big one as it affects our emotional body which is the astral. So our universe and all its dimensions are in a sense one big tapestry all inner connected to each other. For all there is in the cosmos is consciousness itself.

    Sorry for being long. But you asked a very good question so I need to go in detail a bit.

    Love an peace P.
     
  9. Jaimie

    Jaimie Senior Member

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    Hi, I remember smells and words during my flashbacks and during meditation. Not always. It can be very different from one time to another. I can only in some "just see" and am cut off from everything else. One time during a flashback I experienced a smell of a specific person (he was sweaty in the summer time ) that I have not smelled on someone else that I can remember in my own current life, I mean that kind of smell is kind of personal, from a specific body. Maybe there are different kinds of levels on "the recording" of past lives. maybe on one level you "just" see things, on another one is caught in all the emotions concerning the scene and so on. I don't think the current brain one got needs to have experienced the exact same smell in this life in order to remember a past life smell, in order to "smell" it again, but that's just me :)
    /Jaimie
     
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  10. Klaud

    Klaud Senior Member

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    I think you're absolutely correct. I have what I like to call a 'spiritual sniffer', meaning that I can smell, for lack of a better term, the paranormal. Smelling my past lives while sitting in my room is usually an easy task for me. I don't meditate with my scented candles lit because I find it distracting, so my room is mostly unscented when I'm zoned out.

    Pretty sure I've never smelled sweet grass in this life, but I often smell it (and bonfire smoke) during my meditations while trying to view my Native American life. The first time, I just subconsciously knew exactly what that scent was.
     
  11. John Tat

    John Tat Senior Registered

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    I to experiences sound some senses and emotions from past incarnation memories.. From my education I believe its important to understand how it happens and what makes it possible
    To begin with... In my opinion we need to look at the basics.. The human entity cannot record to memory most of these things we are talking about... I'm sure we are all in agreement with that
    We must re experience them to remember them Its important to understand that when we think about good and bad events that have happened to us we can remember the emotions we felt at the time
    What happens is... the memory of the event goes through our brains and we add to the memory the emotions we felt at the time of the memory....that's important to all of this that it is our current emotion not the recorded emotions because there are none I'm not saying the emotions are inaccurate but its important that they are not recorded emotions . senses and sounds
    The same applies to past incarnation memories... think of the brain as a decoder that is plugged into the spiritual memories of our spiritual selves/soul
    As the previous incarnation memories pass through the decoder... our current physical brains... adds all of the senses and emotions of the current physical entity to the memory making them very real to us
    Again we must get back to basics that most of these things cannot be recorded to memory We the current physical entities are complete and absolute proof of that... If our previous incarnation memories did not go through the decoder of the current physical brain they would have little meaning
     
  12. John Tat

    John Tat Senior Registered

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    Hi S&S I have been thinking about your questions in post#2 as I wanted to give the bet answers I can...The physical entity is not spiritual and the spiritual entity is not physical...
    The spiritual entity has one continuous memory...not many individual memories broken up into different in carnations ....BB is BB my spiritual self not Tom. Dick and Harry the physical entities he has occupied... just as all spiritual selves are.... He never dies he goes on and on just as his memories do
    The example I gave ... when we remember events that have happened to us we re experience them with the emotions and senses at the time we recall the events They are not recorded emotions and senses from when they event happened because that is not possible.. Physical memory does not record emotion and senses ..We remember them when we re experience them The same applies when we have previous incarnation memories

    The question is...is spiritual memory recorded through the experiences of the physical entity .. or how the spiritual entity experienced them?
    If spiritual memories are recorded through the memories/experiences of the physical entity then the emotions and senses are not recorded by the spiritual entity because there are none to record by physical memory

    The possibilities the spiritual entity can and does record its own "version" of events untainted by the physical opens up the questions about how that would/could/ work/happen
    "Version is very important because the physical and spiritual "versions" of events would be and are very different... Physical memories are very flawed by many factors including how the physical entity perceived the events happened...overall physical memory is not exactly an accurate record of the events it has experienced
    Our sub conscious is also flawed ... Among other things it creates our emotions and stores our beliefs

    I believe its reasonable to assume that spiritual memory is independent of physical memory ... if so we need to have some understandings of how the physical brain interrupts spiritual memory
    This is where the complications really do begin because physical and spiritual memory are very different especially the mechanisms used to record the memories.. we always need to go back to... one is physical the other is spiritual
    The human perception of spiritual memory is based on how physical memory works...... Its the same as images of gods, angels and so on are drawn in physical form.. which again is not a reliable source of how things are

    If spiritual memory was much the same as physical memory then spiritual memory would be just as flawed as physical memory ...So when we talk about previous incarnation memories with all of the emotions and senses associated with those memories in my opinion we need to take consider how much of the memories from our spiritual selves ends up being accurate after being filtered through the physical brain

    Spiritual real time memories are a different thing ... I have talked about them before...real time memories are not "flashbacks" The word "flashbacks" tells you what they ....what "flashbacks" are saying is... a spiritual memory is taking me backwards in time to another time and place. The important thing is those who experiences "flashbacks" understand exactly what is happening....they are going back to another time and place... and these flashbacks are processed by the current physical brain as they are happening.. again not exactly a reliable interruption of the "flashback"

    Our spiritual selves real time memories are very different to "flashbacks"...they are real time nothing to do with going back in time... when you experience real time memories of your spiritual self none of the memory has been tainted by the physical just like experiencing real events as they happen in the physical and can only be gotten to through years of dedication to improving your skills of meditations with your spiritual self... even then they are random I cannot make them happen.. I sometimes feel our spiritual selves live in continuous real time ... there is no past only now...that's what it feels like but it's well beyond my compression how it could work



    ALL The Best
     
  13. SeaAndSky

    SeaAndSky Senior Registered

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    Hi John,

    Most materialist scientists believe the human brain is where we "exist" and when it is gone, we are gone. The alternative viewpoint, which can also be supported on the evidence, is that the human brain is a switchboard or control panel for the "real" us--what you and I refer to as the spiritual self (though I am not always sure we are talking about the same thing). In fact, there is a lot of evidence in reincarnationist circles that the real us (the spiritual self) merely extends its attention and control from wherever it exists to experience life through a physical body, using the physical body as a means to interface with the physical world and experience it. And, it appears that the spiritual self of most people can also be capable of divided awareness, living and experiencing things via its own spiritual "senses" and from its own perspective (as a spirit) at the same time that it is physically incarnate.

    This would mean that the spiritual self, once it has finished with a physical lifetime, possesses and stores (1) the memories of what took place (including the emotions felt, etc.) by and while utilizing the body. And also has (2) a separate set or "track" of memories that are not limited by the physical and may be completely different in quality from the physical/emotional memory set retained from the its physical lifetime. So, twin memory tracks or sets would exist, though both are stored in the continuing spiritual self: (1) memories of what were experienced as or by the physical entity including thoughts, emotions, pain, etc; and (2) parallel memories of what was being experienced as a non-physical spirit entity (often covering the same experiences).

    It seems to me that most people who do regressions can only tap into the first set of spirit memories (1) from the physical. Hence, they only re-experience or remember something that happened from (1) the subjective standpoint of the PL physical being. Some seem to be able to tap into the second set of (2) spirit self memories (which may be from a more timeless objective perspective as you suggest). However, I think for most this is fairly limited. A third group seem to get a mix of some type.

    The third group (that get a mix of (1) and (2)) will often have a shifting memory or re-experience of what took place. They may be tapping just into the stored physical entity's subjective experience stored in spirit memory (1) through the senses of the PL person. They may switch back and forth from that type of sense memory to a more extensive objective spirit memory (2) where they see what was experienced as if they are watching it from the outside like a movie. They may also re-experience physical "feelings" stored in spirit memory (1) or have a different "spiritual" (and possibly more neutral) reaction tapping into (2) spirit. So, this type of memory of PLs can be a bit of a hodge-podge.

    Overall, by my observation, most people tend to only be able to tap into the (1) physical set of memories stored by the continuing spirit, some get a mix of (1) and (2), and a few may just get it from spirit perspective (2). Anyhow, this is just my sense of things. Others may have their own.

    Cordially,
    S&S

    PS--I am not using the term "objective" in some kind of ultimate sense. I just mean from more of an "outside" perspective.

    PPS--Time and timelessness are tricky subjects. I am trying to avoid getting into that side of things, though the spirit seems to exist in a more timeless or less temporally limited/restrained state.
     
  14. John Tat

    John Tat Senior Registered

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    Hi S&S I understand what you were talking about... It is my opinion from my meditations with BB and my source what is out there not only about this subject but also the spiritual, the afterlife and reincarnation is way over the top.. It is all much more basic and fundamental than what comes from the imaginations of man... As you know I have no faith and do not believe most if not all that is out there
    Based on what I know from my meditations most of what is out there could not be more wrong.. Your descriptions of how memories work in my opinion is a good example of over the top beliefs ...From my knowledge its nowhere near as complicated as that ...That of course is not your fault .. you are going by what others say about these things... As I have said its very difficult when I'm the only one saying the earth is not flat when everyone else believes it is

    All The Best
     
  15. SeaAndSky

    SeaAndSky Senior Registered

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    Hi John,

    I'd be interested for you to share your perspective on the spiritual, the afterlife and reincarnation. It would be good to have an approach that was much more basic and fundamental than what comes from the "imaginations of man". It also would be good because I expect that it would provide a better basis for understanding the basis for your statements on a variety of issues, such as no cross-gender reincarnation, no memory of smells, feelings, etc. Perhaps you could provide the overview and then say how it leads to the other things you have said over the years.

    Cordially,
    S&S
     
  16. John Tat

    John Tat Senior Registered

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    Hi S&S I have some things going on right now so I will get some things together as soon as I can.. I need to think it through so I can presents things in a logical manner... but off the top of my head I will talk about a couple of things
    In my opinion its important to have the proper understandings of the important words used to describe the reincarnation process the afterlife and the spiritual...Unfortunately most beliefs of how it all works are based on the physical and physical life... I cannot say enough times that the physical is not spiritual and the spiritual is not physical
    I will talk briefly about the word afterlife..Just like most if not all of the important words about all of these things the word "afterlife" is a conundrum...because it means many different things to many different people... and that is one of the major problems with all of these things... the downside of all of this is...there are mountains of different beliefs and interruptions about not only the afterlife but also reincarnation and the spiritual
    What does the word "afterlife" really mean?...does it mean an existence after death.. heaven and so on...or immortality.. or a place to go and rest and be with others from our families... or place we go to to reaccess things...or does it actually mean reincarnation.. the next physical life after this one.. or does it mean something else?
    In my opinion its important for us to understand what we are talking about... what we believe in.. and understanding what these important words actually men is important because they only have one meaning not many
    After comments of what people believe the afterlife is I will continue ...With all of these things it's difficult to stop ourselves from confusing spiritual things with physical things that cause most interruptions to be on a physical level .. also what has been out there for generations has developed into some kind of truths

    All The Best
     
  17. KenJ

    KenJ Assistant Archivist and Moderator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    I'll start, with me it means everything that occur is after I leave my physical body, and possibly including the memories I've had.
     
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  18. SeaAndSky

    SeaAndSky Senior Registered

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    Hi John,

    You are right about the term "afterlife" being a very general term. However, on a board like this, it is generally going to refer to what happens between physical lifetimes. So, to use some terminology being used on another thread, our current phase of existence is the "womb to tomb" part of the cycle. The term afterlife encompasses the other "tomb to womb" part of the cycle.

    The real questions for me is "what" is experiencing this cycle, "what" it experiences on the "tomb to womb" part of the cycle, and "what" transformations does it experiences during this part of the cycle. I have my own ideas. You have yours.

    Cordially,
    S&S
     
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  19. John Tat

    John Tat Senior Registered

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    Hi S&S I cannot make any comments about womb to tomb or tomb to womb because neither exists there are no such things All The Best
     
  20. SeaAndSky

    SeaAndSky Senior Registered

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    Hi John,

    Womb to tomb is just another way of saying life from birth to death. If you don't believe that exists, then you don't believe that you or the rest of us exist. In terms of tomb to womb, that is likewise a way of saying existence from death to rebirth. You are entitled to your opinion on that, but this is a reincarnation board, so I don't know why your opinion would be that this does not exist.

    Cordially,
    S&S
     
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