If theres a spirit realm where does reincarnation come in?

Discussion in 'Reincarnation Questions' started by milkdrops, Apr 13, 2007.

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  1. milkdrops

    milkdrops New Member

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    Okay another one of my questions:

    If indeed when we die we get reincarnated where does the spirit realm come in? does one hang around the spirit realm for a while until they or whomever (god perhaps) decides you come back as someone else?

    Alot of folks say when you die you are instantly reborn then some say you dont exist for a bit until you are re born but the concept of a spirit realm must come into it.

    Your thoughts please people.
     
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  2. vanhalen50one50

    vanhalen50one50 Senior Registered

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    Hi milkdrops,
    What it boils down to is your own personal beliefs. I believe that when we die we go to the "spirit realm" "heaven" "summer land" whatever you want to call it, and we go through our life review with our spirit guide. I believe that we review every second of our life with our spirit guide who is non-judgmental. Then, together, the spirit guide and the soul decide which lessons need to be learned, and which life would best teach those lessons, (I personally believe in a council instead of one god, and once you and your spirit guide have figured out which life would best suit your needs you go in front of the council who will suggest an alternative if the one chosen would not serve the needs as well, but it all comes down to personal choice. You can either listen to the council or go with what you want.) Along with the past life review, I believe that we get some "down time" to rest, heal from the previous life, and be with other souls who were in our previous lives. But as I said, it comes down to your own personal beliefs. I hope I have shed some light on the subject. If you have any questions feel free to pm me.

    VanH.
     
  3. Ailish

    Ailish Administrator Emerita

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  4. Quintessence

    Quintessence No One

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    The spirit realm is always here. Some people can tap into it.
    Our spirits do reside within this realm, and imo our souls absorb into the spirit after death. Both are within this realm in between lives.
    Time has no meaning there, so one wouldn't necessarily reincarnate "instantly". Doesn't matter if you spend 5, 10, 20 years there. That is only third dimensional time.
     
  5. Amy

    Amy Senior Registered

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    I could not have said it better. :thumbsup:
     
  6. tanguerra

    tanguerra Moderator Emeritus

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    Yes Milkdrops. That is about what they reckon happens on the whole. The threads Ailish listed have good discussions on the detail of it all.

    I agree with the others though, that a 'part' of us is always in the spirit realm even though while we are in a body, running about doing things, getting into scrapes and so on, most of our attention is taken up with the activities of the body and the mind - for very good practical reasons.

    I sometimes think that when we are asleep our 'spirit' might pop off 'upstairs' for some R&R just as our body is also taking a rest. Death is just a somewhat more profound state then sleep.

    I see the soul as something very large (existing outside of time and space) which is containing the body and the various lives (which are smaller and exist within time and space) if you follow me - not the other way around. I don't think it is a question of the soul 'going' anywhere, more the bodies come and go - like changing your outfit from one day to the next.
     
  7. Charles Stuart

    Charles Stuart Probationary

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    Hi Tanguerra,

    Well, to me we alternate between realms. We continue to access the Spiritual Realms during sleep or under certain other alternate states, but not simultaneously. To me it is an "either...or....".

    I'll go along with Vanhalen concerning the existance of a "Council". According to African spiritual beliefs, God / Allah / Olorun (or whatever you want to call Her/Him) delegated powers to his first son (Yeshua, Jesus, Oshalah or whatever you wish to call him) together with other "lesser gods", which in the African spiritualist lines are known as the "Orishas". These "Orishas" received delegated powers over "The Creation", but ultimately ALL decisions are made by the "Great Architect of the Universe", with Whom the "Orishas" or "Members of the Higher Court" are closely and intimately connected.

    As well as our own free will, it is the "Members of the Higher Hierarchies", or the "Great White Society", who also make decisions and influence our destinies, always for the benefit of the spiritual evolution of all mankind.

    Hi Milkdrops,

    My belief is that in between incarnations we spend time in the Spiritual Realms analysing what we did right and wrong in our previous incarnation, preparing for the next one, and also, depending on the Soul/Spirit's evolutionary degree, aiding and assisting others in their evolution also. "Spiritual Guides" are, to me, Soul/Spirits who have reached a certain evolutionary degree in which they are prepared, ready and receive permission to assist others...
     
  8. Green26

    Green26 Senior Registered

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    I have got a question regarding reincarnation and the spiritual realms. In the various OBE literature like that of Robert Monroe for example there are various reports of discarnate entities which dwell in the spiritual realms. These beings range from benevolent spirits to evil demon like beings.

    If this is true, how can an evil spirit/soul dwell in the spiritual realms without transcending the reincarnation process as it is suggested possible in the Tibetan Book of the dead etc.? Does this mean that it is not necessary to transcend the reincarnation process through spiritual practices and evolution and that reincarnation is voluntary? Or are these bad souls only in the spiritual realms temporarlily before being reincartnated in a new body?
     
  9. Charles Stuart

    Charles Stuart Probationary

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    Hi Green26,

    This seems to be what happens... :thumbsup: There is no such thing as an "eternal hell".

    It seems there are different realms in the Spiritual Universe, including the lower ones, but the good news is that such a transition is only temporary. Through reincarnation, ALL Soul/Spirits have the opportunity to correct themselves, transcend and progress.
     
  10. tommcfearsom

    tommcfearsom Senior Registered

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    Progress of the Soul

    Hello Folks

    There are a wide range of beliefs concerning "the Spirit World" some of which contain a type of post mortem reincarnation. The belief is that thru study of the spiritual or experience of claravoyance once a person becomes aware they are a "soul" rather than reincarnating into a physical body (which is considered regressive) they can express themselves and learn thru a number of different spiritual or energy bodies. These bodies can range from the appearance of the life just lived to that of being angelic like.

    This type of world view is held by a wide range of Spiritualist. This afterlife is refered to as The Summerland ( there is a Summerland, California, a former Spiritualist camp).

    Some of these principals are reflected in the beliefs of comtemporary religions such as the Mormon Church.

    I hope that this is useful.

    John R.
     
  11. Deborah

    Deborah Executive Director Staff Member

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    HI Milkdrops,

    Ian Stevenson and Jim B. Tucker's research suggests that the majority of children studied describe ordinary lives. Careful study has shown there is an average of 15 months between death and rebirth.
     
  12. Littlemoon

    Littlemoon Senior Registered

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    my own beliefs.

    I believe that we can stay in the "spirit realm" for as long as we need and/or want to. I think that it's up to us to come back when the time is "right," whenever that may be.

    I have recently started to reconsider my feelings on free will and fate and how this plays out in how long we wait between lives. It's hard for me to get connected to my "spiritual" self and work through the way that lives are planned and/or how they coincidentally unfold. It's a combination of the two, I'm sure, but which way has more weight?
     
  13. Charles Stuart

    Charles Stuart Probationary

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    Hi Littlemoon,

    There is a saying in spiritualist circles that "There is no such thing as a coincidence", but rather that ALL events and connections have a reason and a purpose. Under this light, it would not be a "coincidence" that we have all met here on the CPL Forum.

    My understanding is that yes, we do determine much of our destinies through the exercise of our free will and the use of our consciousness, but the remaining 50% is not up to us, and is certainly not coincidental, but determined by the "Higher Sources"...

    Also, under this same light, it seems that not all Soul/Spirits have the autonomy to determine how long they will spend in the spiritual realms in between lives. Many, if not most, are sent back upon determination without any say on the matter - particularly those who have not yet reached a certain evolutionary degree.
     
  14. Charles Stuart

    Charles Stuart Probationary

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    Let me add:

    It seems that when Jesus said: "My Father's house has many mansions", he was referring to the different "layers" of the Spiritual Universe, as well as the inumerous orbes in the Physical Universe. These "layers" or "Realms of Existance" vary from the lowest (known as "hell") to the highest (known as "Heaven"). Between them, there are also other layers, including the one that tommcfearsom has referred to as "Summerland".

    Apparently the determination of which layer each Soul/Spirit will remain in during the period in beteween incarnations is determined by the density of the Spiritual Body, which is in direct relation the the Soul/Spirit's evolutionary degree and consciousness. The more developed the Soul/Spirit, the less dense will be his/her Spiritual Body, and the higher it will reach within such realms.

    When it is said in the bible that "On the 7th day, He rested", what is inferred is that "The Conscious Source of All Things" established all the laws that rule the universe, and from then on the universe evolves without the need of any further Divine intervention. All processes occur naturally, and the "Laws" are imprinted in each human soul.

    This "density" of the Spiritual Body determines the "Realm of Existance" it will be attracted to after disincarnating, and will also determine the force of attraction, and consequently the term, for a Soul/Spirit to be drawn back into the physical/material realm for a new incarnation...
     
  15. Quintessence

    Quintessence No One

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    Coincidences display how everything is connected.
    They are messages from expressions of source energy.
    That would depend on one's definition of developed. There is a multitude of old souls with dense "spiritual bodies".
    In fact, this is not unusual at all.
     
  16. Crissy2

    Crissy2 Senior Registered

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    This is one of my deep felt questions and one of the things I have continually tried to research my whole life. More so recently. From what I have experienced and seen, I only conclude that upon a natural death, we then retreat back to heaven or back to the spirit realm where our true home is and then choose to come back at a later time. (whether we choose or are sent; I'm not quite sure yet) We can visit the earthly realm at will to check on family whilst in spirit but usually after a certain amount of time has passed. I'm not sure what is done durring this amount of time back at "home" but I've noticed there is a period that a deceased seems to stay away before "popping in for visits."

    Upon a sudden, un-natural death, the transition can be quite different. It seems that your spirit can actually stay within the realm here and often needs help moving forward. This is an observation as well and i'm still trying to solve whether or not they are actually stuck here or just their energy. However, how energy can communicate while the soul is somewhere up above is beyond me and how we can move them on to the other side only leads me to believe that souls can actually get stuck here.......... Did I just go off topic?

    Reincarnation crissy, Reincarnation! Sorry.

    I think that we spend quite a bit of time in the spirit realm and that is why it feels so much like "home" and this place feels so foreign or wierd.
     
  17. Charles Stuart

    Charles Stuart Probationary

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    Hi Quintessence,

    I'm not too sure I go along with "Old Souls" and "Young Souls".

    I mean it as morally, spiritually and in consciousness. I mean, how spiritually developed a Soul was that kid who shot and killed 33 people?

    Hi Crissy,

    Yes, I believe some Souls do get "stuck" in the physical realms and spend time wandering. This seems to be particularly true with suicidals, seeing as their connection to the Earthly bounds was severed prior to its due time...
     
  18. tanguerra

    tanguerra Moderator Emeritus

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    The nature of 'good and evil' are, like everything else in this multidimensional sphere of being we inhabit, (the multiverse), relative terms. In order for there to be dark there must be light and so on and so forth.

    There is no cosmic Santa keeping score of who is naughty and who is nice. We are on our own recognizance. We are free to choose how we will conduct ourselves. Does our behaviour serve to make us happier, more conscious, more integrated, more healthy and whole? If not, why not. These are the important questions. Good is. Evil is. Life is. Suffering is. Love is.

    The wicked behaviour of disturbed people (and disturbed spirits for that matter) is deplorable by others who are more 'aligned' as Quintessence says, but ultimately, it simply 'is what it is' and our reaction to it is our concern.
     
  19. Quintessence

    Quintessence No One

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    Very true. I don't think anything is evil per se. You have fear, that leads to other emotions. Then you have love, which leads to more. The former can be perceived as "ego".
    Imo, God had to go through this process as well. But a long "time" ago, God had to recreate this, and it chose to sustain positivity. Sustain that positive pole.

    In this dimension I think so, yes. But I do believe in certain dimensions there can be total dark, or total light. Dimensions balance one another out. There are millions.
    Well anyway, the one we are in provides duality. Duality that is light and dark. Duality that is gender.

    Totally. Part of our evolution is to learn to make "good" choices. We dictate a lot more than we think we do. :)

    Eventually, in my opinion. No matter what road you take, you will be led right where you started. And when you go back to where you started you begin to have "realizations" about yourself. Self-realization is part of being aligned with the source. So no matter what you are doing, you are evolving and creating. Some just go through the evolutionary process "quicker".
    I agree. This is why judgement does not serve us. A lot of things just *are*. We have experienced in one life or another what simply *is*. When we make a judgement, we often judge ourselves. Our reaction can be that of love.
    He may have been very spiritually developed, just out of alignment. :) Going in and out of alignment in different lifetimes is the natural course of things. It is up to us whether or not we choose to stay in alignment.
     
  20. Deborah

    Deborah Executive Director Staff Member

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    HI Milkdrops,

    I am curious what your understanding of the "spirit realm" is? Is it something that is separate from us? Part of who we are? A distant place? An integrated space?
     
  21. Amy

    Amy Senior Registered

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    Thank you for this explanation Charles. Makes good sense! :D
     
  22. Charles Stuart

    Charles Stuart Probationary

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    Thanks, Amy. :thumbsup: ;) It's nice to read a nice reply once in a while...

    It's taken me over 30 years (just in this lifetime) of seeing, experiencing, reading (in particular The Book of Spirits and The Gospel According to Spiritism, both compiled by Allan Kardec), studying, pondering and A LOT OF PAIN to come to these conclusions. I am not attempting to "save" anyone or state that I am right and others are wrong. I am just sharing what I have learned...

    Tanguerra,

    I'm not saying that there has to be a "Santa" to judge us, but that the process occurs naturally!
     
  23. tanguerra

    tanguerra Moderator Emeritus

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    Hi Charles,

    I am not disagreeing with you. I always like to read your thoughts. Often there is just nothing more to add, as you put it so well. I don't have your understanding of the mechanics, but I feel I sort of understand the basic principles.

    I agree that it is a natural process also. I believe, however, that many people (not you of course :) ) imagine some kind of divine being who is 'marking' them on their performance, when ultimately there is only one who is concerned with how someone conducts themselves - that is ourselves - but of course, we are divine beings also.

    We are all multidimensional and 'divine' to kind of tie back into the topic. We all exist in the 'spirit world' at one
    'level' simultaneously while existing in this one, even when we are being very very bad and not nice at all.

    Yes, Quintessence. I appears we are very much of like mind.
     
  24. Charles Stuart

    Charles Stuart Probationary

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    Hi Tanguerra,

    I also very much enjoy reading your posts, but we'll just have to disagree on this one.

    My view is that WE are our Souls, and that each Soul is unique, indivisible and eternal. I can access the Spiritual Realm, but I am either there or here. Not simultaneously in both.

    It is my experience that we are here to evolve, and if we are in error, we will certainly respond for our errors - and it is also my belief that this is determined not just by us, but by those who rule over the Creation, for this is a universal and "Divine Law". I do not see this as the Christian Church's dogmas put it, with a trial in front of God, but I believe that the "Law" is clear and is to be followed, and that it is reinforced by the Spiritual Masters.
     
  25. milkdrops

    milkdrops New Member

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    I guess my understanding of the spirit realm would be the place where our soul/energy reside until we are reincarnated.
    I'd say we were all already connected with our spirit/soul only we currently all are in another dimension the "physical world".

    Of course weither we are with god or buddah or whomever whilst in the spiritual realm of course is a big seperate debate but that would be my understanding of the spirit realm. In science it would be considered another dimension. One we most likely couldnt even begin to understand.
     
  26. Deborah

    Deborah Executive Director Staff Member

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    Thank you for sharing you POV Milkdrops. :D
     
  27. milkdrops

    milkdrops New Member

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    Its worth thinking about I guess. :cool
     
  28. Quintessence

    Quintessence No One

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    I think I wanted to add a little something, because I used to think spirit and soul were two different things. Lately, I've been thinking they are the same, just in two different places. The soul is within the body, the spirit within the spirit realm.
    They are the same things operating differently.
    The soul is connected to the physical body and its identity: male, female, emotional energy. The only thing that disconnects you from the spirit is the ego. This includes left over energy from past incarnations. That is why I think it is so important to heal past lives and their energy blocks.
    Once you do you can easily tap into the Higher Self.

    I am starting to think that there really isn't two of anything. That duality is purely illusory.
    With reincarnation there are not several yous. Just one you because it's all one energy. Being male, female, or a certain nationality is a temporary projection of the soul at given moments.
    I also believe if we were to constantly channel that realm it would affect the space/time around us.
     
  29. tanguerra

    tanguerra Moderator Emeritus

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    Yes Milkdrops. I think you have grasped it well. The idea is that after we die, before we reincarnate, in between lives, we spend some time in this 'spirit world' - very possibly having a nice time communing with God (however you conceive her) and our spirit brothers and sisters, receiving spiritual instruction, rest and restoration while plotting our next move.

    However, just to confuse things a little bit more, in this 'other dimension' there is no time (at least not like the time we are accustomed to) so all this sort of takes place all at once, even though our monkey brains can have a hard time trying to compute that.

    As Quintessence said:

     
  30. Charles Stuart

    Charles Stuart Probationary

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    Hi Quintessence,

    Well, again I beg to disagree. In my understanding,"Soul" is the true essence of who/what we are, whereas "Spirit" is the Spiritual Body that surrounds the Soul, and is with us even when we are incarnate (in a physical body). The term "I saw a Spirit" would therefore mean having seen a Soul in a spiritual body rather than in a physical one.

    I see no duality. To me we are either incarnate in a physical body or detached from it, in spiritual form, but never in both simultaneously. there are no "several of us", just one of us, here and now in a physical body, and after death in spiritual form.

    I believe that a process similar to what occurs to our physical body also occurs to our spiritual body: once we can no longer draw from the vital fluids of a given realm (like our physical realm) the Soul detaches and takes on a new body according to the fluids of the dimension or orbe it has been attracted to.

    To me, the spiritual realms are, indeed, different dimensions. Apparently there are nine. Physicists have mathematically calculated the possibility of the existance of ten. Which realm our spiritual body and Soul will be attracted to is in direct relation to the density of our spiritual body, which is determined by our level of spiritual development and consciousness, seeing as, as you have already said, it is our mind/soul/consciousness that creates not only our spiritual form but also, to a certain degree, the reality of the realms we will be attracted to.

    It is also my view that the "different sense of time" in the spiritual dimensions results from the fact that, due to the lesser density, events and the manifestations of our thoughts occur at a much faster rate than in the dense physical/material realm.
     
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