• Thank you to Carol and Steve Bowman, the forum owners, for our new upgrade!

My take on the case of empirical proof

PowerofSoul

PowerofSoul

New Member
Hello, all.

Does anyone ever wonder what pure empirical proof for reincarnation would look like?

At this current time, the strongest suggestive factors, in my opinion, live among the cases of spontaneous PL recall by children. (I can vouch for having very rich memories as a child myself.)

However, we've yet to observe the movement of consciousness from form to form.

Perhaps, if we are correct, it's very similar to the discovery of the microscopic world. We now know that within our macro world dwells a fascinatingly vast micro-world. If it was, say....the 1300s, the idea of microscopic beings living on most things (and even us) would be one considered "out there," to say the very least.

Just like the microscope example, I think there is another part of the whole process we are not yet able to measure with our current apparatus; let alone fully conceive it.

The closest we can currently get with observing reincarnation I believe, is thermodynamics. The body even sustains itself with completely new material throughout a lifetime.

I also happen to believe that if it is true, we will not find this empirical way to observe it for quite some time. I think humanity as a whole still has a lot of lessons to learn, and the true nature of death is one most are not ready to know.

Thoughts? I enjoy reading everyone's posts here. :D

PS, if I seem scientifically illiterate, I apologize. It's not my expertise :p
 
PowerofSoul said:
However, we've yet to observe the movement of consciousness from form to form.
Click to expand...
Fortunately, the standards for what defines empirical proof has changed over the years, which has allowed theoretical science to form more realistic paradigms. Quantum theory, for example, would never have become acceptable if strict Newtonian rules had been followed. And, if we had been continually restricted to only what we can sense with our immediate faculties, then we would still be shackled to the belief that the heavens rotate around the earth.


Yet, there is still a battle being waged between ignorant skeptics who cling to the primitive standards of proof versus genuine theorists, who know that proof of anything is merely the temporary absence of exceptions to the rule. Our assumption, for example, that all crows are black cannot be considered proof, since it is inevitable that white crows do exist. By the same token, the assumption that consciousness emanates from the physical brain cannot be considered proof, since too many examples exist wherein consciousness has been found to exist outside of physical existence.
 
I agree. Most discoveries seem to come when one steps out of established boundaries.


As for ignorant skeptics, I really try my best not to bother. Thousands of spontaneous recall cases turn out to be verified upon investigation; when you read on it, you'll find an uncanny consistency. Yet, even this is not enough for a mere consideration. If that isn't, what will be for them?


Not only that, but the classical view of consciousness does no justice to the concept. Despite all the neurological research over the years, science has yet to see just what it is that observes, if that makes sense. For that to happen, science itself has to expand.


I like to see the brain like a radio. It's no more the source of consciousness than a radio is for the program.
 
Always bet your money on the "heretics". The heretics are always proven to be right. It may take 25, 50, 100, or more years. But they are always proven right.
 
Nightrain said:
Yet, there is still a battle being waged between ignorant skeptics who cling to the primitive standards of proof versus genuine theorists, who know that proof of anything is merely the temporary absence of exceptions to the rule.
Click to expand...
This...all "facts" are simply "the current story" that has yet to be countered. Remember when the earth was flat?


As for the necessity of empirical proof, it is only a requirement in a fruitless effort to convince others of what they obviously feel but will not accept. After all, their lifeplan may not have scheduled an understanding of reincarnation and the functions of the soul for this lifetime. That does not mean they will not participate in it...just that they are oblivious as to why and how it all works. No problem...they'll come to it when they must.
 
I agree. I think each soul comes to an acceptance of past life experience when the time is right for it's development. Trying to explain, or convince, someone who is not at that point is fruitless.
 
BriarRose said:
Trying to explain, or convince, someone who is not at that point is fruitless.
Click to expand...
A slightly different variation on the theme came from my son, who is very clear on what I think and feel...especially since alot of my initial understanding and belief in past lives came through his memories and tutelage! He, at the ripe old age of thirteen, said "Dad, I can understand how and why we live again and again, but I want to be here just to be here! Why do you think I came?"


Indeed. Some of us are here to have a wholly human experience, while others are here to discover our less-human aspects. Another lesson I've learned from this wise soul.
 
usetawuz said:
... alot of my initial understanding and belief in past lives came through his memories and tutelage! He, at the ripe old age of thirteen, said "Dad, I can understand how and why we live again and again, but I want to be here just to be here! Why do you think I came?"
Click to expand...
Are any of your son's PL memories posted here? I find that interesting that he taught YOU. Were any of his memories researched and validated?
 
I haven't gone into any detail of his memories on here as they are his...while they may provide some curiosity, they follow the same course as those documented here, and I obviously cannot convey the emotion and detail as he can. I also feel one usetawuz on this board is enough for now! Though I will say, in one case I have been able to verify a name he mentioned on several occasions and obtained outside confirmation that the man was a participant in some of the specific events he described, and the events unfurled along the lines of that description...no way he had been exposed to this particular scenario in this lifetime, there is no tv or visual depiction of it and it was prior to his being able to read.


As for my learning from him, it began the moment he was born...a month early and his eyes were the most intensely focused I'd ever seen in a newborn...he took his first breath and began to scream, and when it was apparent he had caught his breath he abruptly stopped. His eyes seemed to frantically search the room as he was held...when he was finally handed to me, he seemed to stop searching and directed that intense focus on me. His open hand seemed to be reaching for me and when I put my finger to it he grasped it and held on tightly and he was completely calm. At that time a nurse said "He knows you!" He stayed focused on my face and holding my finger until he fell asleep about ten minutes later. I was changed forever.


Reviewing where our lives have intersected in the past, which I found through the akashic records, it is apparent we've followed the same patterns as this sojourn...at some point in each of those prior lives, he ends up living life well and efficiently and I come to understand how fortunate I am to be his father/son/mother/daughter/brother/sister/best friend, etc. I realize he is moving at a much faster pace than am I despite starting much later. I believe that finding this truth so early in our relationship enables me to focus on the reality of our relationship...being the best father I can be, while also allowing him room to use the abilities he came with. I know this sounds like any motivated father, but to me the wonder and awe of the broader view of the relationship helps me see it more as a mission, an opportunity, than simply as a biological relationship...all the while I use his example as a guide incarnate.
 
I think if I were 13 (or even 5) and someone was able to research and prove my past life memories to be true I would think it was pretty "cool".
 
argonne1918 said:
I think if I were 13 (or even 5) and someone was able to research and prove my past life memories to be true I would think it was pretty "cool".
Click to expand...
Likewise, if you grew up knowing your previous lives, wouldn't it be like growing up left-handed? Or blond-haired? Sort of a case of "it is what it is." And he told me about his past lives...the verification was for me...he had no doubt. This child doesn't even carry karma...his imbalances are addressed sometimes instantly and other times within days. With that level of understanding and control of his universe, his focus is on what he is doing and where he is going...all forward, rather than on what he can find out about his past...he already knows that.


I asked him if he would mind if I shared his stories here and he said he would rather I didn't.
 
Do you think more children are being born now, say in the last 20 years or so, who remember their past lives? When I was growing up it was sort of an "alien" concept. But maybe adults just assumed kids were talking "gibberish" or making up stories.
 
I don't think we would notice the signs if we weren't open to them. My husband easily can write off the comments my son makes (regarding past lives), when I read into them and understand what he's essentially saying. I think my husband does believe, deep down inside, but he will not admit it. He just writes things off.


Parents of children growing up in cultures that do not believe in past lives, will not believe, or probably even notice the signs. Therefore, I don't think more children are aware of their past lives, then say when we were younger. I think we are just more aware of past lives as we observe our children.
 
I think that if we are able to know our past lives, it is also possible to know our future life - at least as far ahead to our next incarnation. The future is more difficult to determine, but I feel that some people do see their future lives, but may be unaware of it. That awareness of a future life would be the key element to providing at least some initial proof of reincarnation. This would have to be accomplished by the documentation of both future and present lives, describing details of both and saving this record in some information base which can be retrieved at a future time, by a researcher. There would have to be hundreds of these accounts saved in order for this to have any chance of success. The assumption made here would be that several reincarnated children would remember their most immediate past life, and could learn of this data base, and then confirm their past life idenities with a researcher, who would listen to the detailed memories of these children and then look for a match in the data base. Problems with this method would be that most people do not develop an awareness of their future incarnation. Also, this would have to be a long term research project, investing a lot of time and resources.
 
Ghost of Gumby said:
Also, this would have to be a long term research project, investing a lot of time and resources.
Click to expand...
That's probably why it hasn't been tried yet. Sounds pretty complicated.
 
argonne1918 said:
That's probably why it hasn't been tried yet. Sounds pretty complicated.
Click to expand...
Yes it would, and it would require many years of devoted research by a number of individuals from many professions. Unfortunately this type of research does not get much support.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top