Reality and Quantum Mechanics

Discussion in 'SCIENTIFIC and ANECDOTAL research' started by stardis, Apr 29, 2009.

  1. stardis

    stardis Senior Registered

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    There seems to be more writing available lately about the interplay of quantum mechanics with biology. The interesting thing about this seeming surge in interest is that, I think, most people are going to just accept the idea more and more that reality is defined by the observation of fundamental sub-atomic particles. Maybe another way to say that and one that I like better, is that consciousness creates.

    The "seeming surge" in interest about the fundamental aspects of reality is a bit misleading because I think it is an area of interest that has been growing for decades and we are just becoming more aware of it because it is becoming more main stream science. Experimental methodology for observing quantum effects is being refined to the point where someday science will, I think, have proven to most people's satisfaction that reality is not at all what it appears but is something which we all, at times, have suspected it may be. Reality may indeed be the consciousness created hologram upon which we play and experience existence together as beings of light - sound far-fetched? What do you think about the growing importance of quantum mechanics in scientific articles? Is this the crescendo leading to enlightenment?

    Michael Prescott's blog has an interesting entry about this in which he talks about a new book and whether, as the author's postulate, biology creates reality or as Michael seems to prefer consciousness creates reality. It is an interesting blog post and I found it worthwhile reading.

    I then read the Discover magazine article "Is Quantum Mechanic's Controlling Your Thoughts?" which is also a great article on biological process that are thought to be interacting in a quantum mechanical manner to achieve their purpose. The last section of the article is about the consciousness and the mind which is well worth reading - as is the entire article.
     
  2. Alexnovo

    Alexnovo Senior Registered

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    Stardis, Fascinating article. Thanks for bringing it to our attention. I was struck by this statement;

    I agree with Prescott, that it is unfortunate that Lanza and Berman are sticking solely to a biological materialist view of consciousness when it seems to run counter to what the rest of their theory is. As Prescott puts it,

    It seems that old materialistic orthodoxies die just as hard as other orthodoxies. But I suspect that the evidence is mounting to such an extent that there soon will be a shift in mainstream scientific thought. I have noticed that in order to save the basic materialistic view of the universe, many scientists are turning to what were once non-mainstream ideas. I recently read this article in Discover Magazine about how many are, in order to explain the anthropic principal, turning to the idea that there are an infinite number of parallel universes [so what if our universe seems improbably fine tuned for life, because as there are an infinite number of universes, one like ours, no matter how improbable, had to be created.]


    I personally believe in multiple universes and am delighted the idea is now being seriously explored. My point however, is that while more and more physicists are asking the right questions, I think they are doing so, in a vain attempt to prove the old orthodoxies right. However, with each question asked, and each partial answer found they are moving further and further away from a universe completely made up of matter and closer to one that accepts the idea of a consciousness independent of matter. To me this is its own kind of “tangled hierarchy.”
     
  3. stardis

    stardis Senior Registered

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    Thanks for the link to the multiple universes article, Alex. I love to read these sort of articles. I am trying to listen to the great link you provided to the

    but I am being constantly interrupted.
    Well put, Alex. When people accept the idea of consciousness independent from matter as being the reality of our existence then, I would think, the idea of reincarnating into this physical world wouldn't seem so impossible either. If mankind would think about having to reincarnate back to a world still embroiled in wars and suffering from the effects of pollution then maybe we could truly become an enlightened society in the physical plane of existence.


    What kind of changes would mankind and the planet undergo if we all realized that "what we sow, we shall reap" is true in a very real literal sense?
     
  4. Artzab

    Artzab AS2

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    What I find most amazing about quantum physics is that it even exists as a science. I had weird experiences in 2003/2004 and honestly wanted to brush everything aside. But, in the end, curiosity got the best of me and I came across A Brief History of Time by Stephen Hawking in the summer of 2005 and researched more about physics, cosmology and started even philosophizing about the idea. Is it weird to anyone here that quantum physics was the first thing that made sense to me?
     
  5. Yong

    Yong New Member

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    Yes, that's very weird, because as far as I know, quantum physics doesn't make sense to anyone else, especially the physicists. But since it makes sense to you, perhaps you can explain it to the rest of us, like the nonsensical results in the double slit experiments.


    I fail to see any connection between quantum physics and "consciousness creates" (whatever that means). I don't "create" you by looking at you; all your features (physical, emotional, or spiritual) I had nothing to do in creating it. I merely "force" you to take a determinate shape, size, etc. by observation just as looking at the slits in the double slit experiments does not "create" electrons, but merely force them to take a particle-like behavior rather than wave-like behavior. If those scientists are actually "creating" electrons this way, tell them to start creating something else, say a particle with different mass, different charge, etc. Can't? Why not?
     
  6. Deborah

    Deborah Executive Director Staff Member

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    Hi Yong,

    A quote by Xenophanes, a man who who lived six centuries before Christ I find to be compelling. This was long before science.

    There are a lot of books that discuss what "consciousness creates" means - if you're interested. ;) Let me know I'll post a few for you.

    There are many mystics and Prophets that understand - putting it to words however - a difficult endeavor.
     
  7. Artzab

    Artzab AS2

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    I'd love to know the titles of some books that discusses the meaning of consciousness creates. if you wouldn't mind sharing a few titles, that would be awesome. :)


    That's interesting that there are mystics and prophets that understood physics. are there any mystics or prophets who wrote anything down during their time? Just thinking it would be interesting to hear what they know, to see if anything sounds familiar to me or if I can learn anything from them. :)
     
  8. stardis

    stardis Senior Registered

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    Hello Artzab.


    Have you read The Holographic Universe by Michael Talbot? It is very readable and would give you something to think about regarding consciousness and reality.


    Another interesting book is The Self-Aware Universe: How consciousness creates the material world by physicist Amit Goswami


    An interesting web site with many interesting things to read is TWM reference index.


    Here is something interesting describing the Quantum Enigma - which is the name of a book. Here is a quote from the book description: "The most successful theory in all of science—and the basis of one third of our economy—says the strangest things about the world and about us. Can you believe physical reality to be created by our observation of it? Physicists were forced to this conclusion, the quantum enigma, by what they observed in their laboratories."
     
  9. Artzab

    Artzab AS2

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    I have heard of the book, but haven't read it yet. I've listened to some people talk about it on youtube and it sounds like a very interesting read. Thanks for reminding me about it. :)


    I've heard of Amit's work, as well, but didn't know he also studied consciousness. Pretty cool. Thanks for all the info. I really appreciate it. :)
     
  10. Deborah

    Deborah Executive Director Staff Member

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    Hi Artzab,


    Perhaps the books section would be a place to start? Physics & Science Books (A to Z By Author)


    In particular Bruce Lipton's The Biology Of Belief: Unleashing The Power Of Consciousness, Matter And Miracles
     
  11. djwray

    djwray New Member

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    I have my own document (PowerPoint) about reincarnation which includes references to the role of quantum mechanics. You might consider it to be long-winded but hopefully some people will find it rewarding. It describes the brain as a quantum computer that executes functions surrounding the brain.


    http://www.atotalawareness.com/atotalawareness.pps


    PS I am looking for suggestions about how the document (and the website) can be improved. :)


    Peace


    D J
     
  12. ChrisR

    ChrisR Administrator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Hi DJ, welcome to the forum :)


    I'm sure it's an interesting document that you've written, but unfortunately, the link you gave doesn't work for me, I just get this: Error 404: NOT FOUND!


    Your browser cannot find the document corresponding to the URL you typed in.
     
  13. stardis

    stardis Senior Registered

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    Hi, DJ.


    I've looked at your website and it sounds interesting but, I would prefer reading your theory in the browser and not in an office application on my computer. The website looks nice.


    Additionally:


    I went to another computer where I have Office software and looked through your presentation (too much to simply read and digest at one sitting) -- well done. Where are you going with this? A lot of work has gone into this, obviously, but to what end?


    Being a little bit familiar with Object Oriented Programming, I found your ideas interesting and I will have to re-visit them.
     
  14. djwray

    djwray New Member

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    Thanks for your comments stardis. I fully agree with your point about office vs browser and there is no doubt that others will think the same way. If I am to use an alternative to PowerPoint I would like to at least keep it well formatted.


    To what end? I don't know. At the moment I feel that it's something I need to do. Maybe my subconscious mind is telling me that this is an opportunity to make a worthwhile contribution. It started out as a simple desire to explain a complex personal problem in the hope that it would provide me with some kind of closure. To that end I documented my explanation of the problem as well as I could. That document evolved into a document about human interaction and the role of God in human thought processes, which in turn evolved into a document about reincarnation.


    D J


    http://www.atotalawareness.com/documents/atotalawareness.pps
     
  15. djwray

    djwray New Member

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    Ouch! :butbut: Sorry Chris. Here is the correct location:


    http://www.atotalawareness.com/documents/atotalawareness.pps
     
  16. Eevee

    Eevee Administrator/Archivist Staff Member

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    I have little understanding of quantum mechanics. I started reading Amit Goswami's book 4 times, and I must admit every time I got a bit further in my reading, but I still have to give up after a while. :)


    But I often pondered on the question : did the quantum world not exist before people became conscious of it, I mean during the time when everybody thought that an atom was the smallest undividible part that existed? Did men create the quantum world by wondering if it could exist? Maybe it's a silly question, but for me it is something that I am still thinking about. :)


    Eevee
     
  17. stardis

    stardis Senior Registered

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    I'm not real smart about this but, I think that the pattern for everything is the result of The Creator's or the Conscious Universe's thought patterns. (I don't think that I could ever explain this satisfactorily.) We, as individual bits of consciousness, participate in the thought pattern by "seeing" and "experiencing" this energy pattern as a physical existence. The pattern for the universe has existed since the beginning (whenever or whatever that was) and we are "experiencing" it now - together.


    I think that quantum mechanics is a reflection of the folding and unfolding of the energy pattern that sustains what we observe as the physical universe that we inhabit. Perhaps the energy pattern is our "reality" all the way back to the Original Consciousness.


    Just my opinion and I may change it tomorrow. :)
     
  18. Truthseeker

    Truthseeker Former Moderator

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    If a tree falls in the woods and there is no one there to hear it, does it make a sound?


    No - the "sound" is nothing more than an energy wave in the quantum hologram that is interpreted by your consciousness as sound. If there is no one present to receive this energy wave and interpret it, then there is no sound. In fact, one could argue that if there is no one there to see the tree, then there is no tree. :confused:


    This is an interesting topic. In glad it was brought up. Eventually I'd like to read more on this subject.
     
  19. Nightrain

    Nightrain Senior Registered

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  20. Kalos

    Kalos Senior Registered

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    I haven't read that book but looks quite interesting and most certainly will. Although quantum mechanics is my field and light fascinates me, I had never considered what you describe above - from a philosophical point of view. Thank you for that :)

    By the way, light doesn't travel. I mean, it certainly seems that it does when we "take measurements" using space and time and all these (fine) classic physics - but light itself doesn't experience space, or time for that matter. Going a bit deeper, light doesn't exist until it interacts. Complies with what you said above if I interpreted that correctly.
     

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