Reincarnation VS. Genetic Memory?

Discussion in 'SCIENTIFIC and ANECDOTAL research' started by kstornado11, Aug 23, 2010.

  1. kstornado11

    kstornado11 Senior Registered

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    I have been wondering about this as of late, whether genetic memory plays a role in some "memories" that we think are memories from a past life...? Does anyone have any thoughts on this, or have you come across any research,have any opinions about the subject?
    I wonder because while researching my family tree, I have found most of my ancestors come from Germany & England, & I have many "memories" of both, from early childhood. Could this be a DNA "thing", or actual past life memories? I have had many strong "Nazi" memories that I remember having sine I was a very little girl, & much later, in early adulthood, found out my paternal grandfather ( my dad has no memory of him, as his mother divorced him during the war & remarried an American soldier) WAS a Nazi.
    How could one know whether this sort of thing is a true past life memory, or memories somehow passed through DNA? Makes me think of butterfly migration, how do they KNOW where to migrate? Certainly the momma & papa butterflies don't teach the larvae. They just "know", & similar situations in nature, things passed on generation to generation. Could it be the same w/ humans?
     
  2. dking777

    dking777 Senior Registered

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    I was trying to have a serious discussion about my reincarnation memories with my Mom when I was 15. She kept saying,


    "It is in your genes. It is in your genes."


    At the age of 15 - I had no idea what that meant. I was your typical teen and when she said something about it being passed on through sperm - I was shocked and embarrassed that my Mom had mentioned something to do with sex. I thought she was meant in your jeans as in your britches. I was constantly being told to keep my britches on. But I thought about this theory and told her if that was true - then the alligagtors in the sewers should be walking around with a lot of past life memories because half the teenagers I knew were flushing a lot of their 'genes' down the toliet at our age.


    :D


    My Mom got a laugh out of this.


    But I told her I didn't think that was possible because if memories were passed during conception of a new child - then it would only make sense that memories from that moment back would be passed on.


    How would that explain someone who had a past life memory where a death was involved? They couldn't pass on their genetic make up after they died.


    I had several past life memories that went from birth to death. If it was only in the genes - then memories of a complete life wouldn't be able to be passed on through the genetic make up.


    And what if this particular past life memory didn't involve having children as in the case of a clergyman or someone who refrained from sexual intercourse due to religious beliefs. How could genetics explain how that memory was passed on if no blood line was passed on? Or someone who died on a battlefield in a war - before getting married and having children?


    My Mom was stumped on that one.


    Her only come back was,


    "Maybe the alligators got them and someone ate the alligator meat for dinner and it got passed on in the food."


    :D


    DK
     
  3. Tinkerman

    Tinkerman Administrator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Hello Kstornado...My old friend! good to see you again.


    I've often thought about that very same thing. It reminds me of a book I read entitled "The Seed Remembers." It was about Native American beliefs on just this topic. It has been a long time since I read it but the jist of it was that the seed, for example corn, carries the memories of its ancestors. I think, as I recall, a parallel was drawn to human kind. You know my deep seeded (pun intended) belief in reincarnation was prompted by memories that surfaced from my Great grandfather.... family. Thus one of the reasons I explored this book and a few others, particularly by Native people. I came to the conclusion that the two "theories," reincarnation and genetic memory, are very much related. I suppose the fine precise detail of a PHYSICAL particle containing specific chemically based "memory" is a little out there, but to me this is the wonder of creation. As we try to quantify our reality it seems we are moving inward, down into the deepest and smallest residue of our mind AND physical space...when do the two meet? What if the soul does have a tangible existence in some circumstances? Or perhaps the soul uses this vehicle, a memory molecule, to pass on the information it needs in a physical sense. There are a multitude of possibilities as I let myself think about it. But I always come away knowing that it's OK, there is no conflict in the two... there is a relationship... we remember! Beautiful.


    More later...off to the city. Good seeing ya!


    Tinkerman
     
  4. Nightrain

    Nightrain Senior Registered

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    There were experiments many years ago, which proved only that both halves of cut flatworms remembered pain when exposed to light. This led the media to leave the impression that genes carry memory. However, all it showed was that the flatworm halves maintained a memory, not that it was transferred via the genes.


    In the context of Quantum physics and the theory of a holographic paradigm in which all matter mirrors the experience of the whole, one could easily say that the flatworms, when divided, had access to the same collective consciousness as we sometimes have; which is how psi is considered to work.


    One example of many, which were investigated by the late Dr. Ian Stevenson, involved a child in Burma (now, Myanmar) who had memories that were specifically Japanese. He physically was born of Burmese parents, yet he had all the mannerisms of a Japanese serviceman of the Second World War. Clearly, there was no DNA component to his memories and his apriori knowledge of Japanese customs, diet, and mannerisms.


    It is understood that many of us are most often reborn into the same families for any number of reasons; which could erroneously lead us to assume that chromosomes carry certain characteristics, which may not, necessarily, be true. One theory of how DNA comes into the equation is, that it only correlates with certain characteristics, not that it determines one's characteristics. It has also been shown that certain chromosomes change as a person changes, which indicates that DNA is not written in stone. It may merely be only a reflection of who we are at any particular moment.
     
  5. Truthseeker

    Truthseeker Former Moderator

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    This is a good question and is worthy of consideration. However, in my case, I have memories of being a German soldier in WWII. I have no WWII veterans in my family, And though I have German ancestry, all of my family was in the United States when WWII broke out.


    Also, I had a memory once of a life that I believe was a Buddhist monk in the far east. I have no ancestral ties to Asia, and a monk would not have passed on any genes to the next generation.
     
  6. Tinkerman

    Tinkerman Administrator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    I should clarify that I do not believe that genetic memory is the root of reincarnation. Truthseeker made an excellent point: some lineage is, given that theory, not physically possible. I think that there may be some relationship in a few cases. Perhaps that is just one of many vehicles that memories use to pass forward. I know of several people who believe it pretty strongly...and as I noted above there are some Native Peoples who for centuries have believed this. I gotta think that we are only touching the tip of the iceberg on how it all works... someday when "we meet up yonder" there is going to be some incredible revelations on how it is all tied together. In the mean time I'm just cruizin' along taken' it all in... ;)


    T
     
  7. Lynnette

    Lynnette New Member Staff Member

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    I once read an article somewhere offering another slant to the reincarnation vs genetic memory debate. It discussed the Native theory/tradition about memories echoing through time, such that when we call upon or need them, we can see them.


    They went on to describe the example of medicine men calling on the ancestors or seeking visions to help in their healing. Because they were open minded and seeking answers, they were able to dream or visualise memories from a previous time using the things they were seeking.


    I've often thought about this, as how could so much knowledge have been passed down and carried in similarity across cultures and continents? It could perhaps have been in our genetic memory, or maybe they used those same skills in a previous incarnation, and needing it again and being open to the lesson, 'remembered' it again? Or maybe this echo theory has something in it too...?
     
  8. Eternal Light

    Eternal Light New Member

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    Just a thought here guys... Aren't we forgetting the hundreds of thousands of childrens stories of 'life before life?' Of how and what they remember about being reborn? Of having been in another realm, and of 'choosing' to come back here?


    Are they all lying, or do they have vivid imaginations? Are their memories just something that we can cast aside as fanciful?

    It took me a while to figure where you were coming from with this above (not in the genes, lol, 'cos my folks were real smart), but you have a very valid point here. In fact you had several... I loved your post. :)

    And, in case it wasn't clear the first time, just to show how really slow I can be, :// How on earth could they possibly know if or when the cut flatworms remembered the pain? :confused:

    Didn't he just? :)
     
  9. Nightrain

    Nightrain Senior Registered

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    Flatworms are able to regenerate themselves irregardless of which end is cut. Instead of just the brain-end of the worm growing its tail back, both pieces turn into complete flatworms. Before cutting them, however, researchers inflict a slight electrical shock when a certain stimulus is applied, such as turning on a light, which causes them to physically react. After the cutting and regeneration of the missing half, all of the flatworms react in the same way, when just the stimulus was applied, as if they were being shocked.
     
  10. kstornado11

    kstornado11 Senior Registered

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    I don't know about the worms, nor do I really care.


    I was just curious whether there was something to the genetic memory, or "memories from ancestors" that seem to be handed down. IMHO, there seems to be something to this, & a scientific,natural explanation for it.


    However, it does not, in my opinion, explain all the other cases of apparent reincarnation, unless it is a "universal consciousness" thing going on, or something along those lines.


    Tink!! My Man!! Hearts


    I have missed you, and so good to "see" you again, fellow Kansan!! I am so happy to see you have survived the hellish temps we've endured this summer!! :eek: Darn -- I can't seem to find "The Seed Remembers" in the Kansas library database!! I love to read Native American stuff, as I really think they have a different link to Mother Earth that other Americans lack.


    I am just trying to explore all aspects & possibilities, as you might remember that I seem to come back to this forum in baby steps, over the years. Yet ,something keeps bringing me back....


    maybe one day I will be able to overcome my fears & discover what is bringing me back, & hopefully at the same time I will be able to overcome what is holding me back.
     
  11. Rod

    Rod Senior Registered

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    The logical problem with genetic memory...


    When I first recognised some of my own memories as being those of another person in a past time period, I had never seriously considered reincarnation, or anything "spiritual" or "paranormal" to be even vaguely possible, nor even particularly sane.


    In my mental attempts to explain what was happening to me, I briefly considered the possibility of genetic memory. In theory it makes sense, but the evidence does not support it. For example only about 25% of cases which appear reliable are same-family reincarnations. To make matters worse, it seems like so many past lives that get remembered are those that ended tragically early, leaving no opportunity to pass on genetic material.


    The other problem is that in many cases, such as my own, the past lives were in an entirely different part of the world than where my present-life family would have been. All four of my grandparents were from the Ukraine, with some Russian Jewish heritage before that and possibly some German based on a surname that goes back farther than any records or stories of family history. The first cousins of my great-grandparents came at the very start of the 20th century, and most of the others by about 1910. However the 19th century past-life memories (which do check nicely against actual records of real people) are of being in the USA, of a family with British and Canadian non-Jewish roots. The next life, in the early 20th century was in Western Canada. There is no way that these families and my present one would have ever met, much less provided any genes or even germs to each other!


    Please note that I do NOT suggest my case, or any single case has scientific validity on its own, as it is only a single datum. It is presented only as an example of contradiction with the genetic memory concept that exists in many documented situations. For the reasons in this message, repeated across many cases, I reject the genetic hypothesis and would propose further research into what other mechanisms could account for past-life memories.


    ...Rod
     
  12. Tinkerman

    Tinkerman Administrator Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Hey ya Tornado! I dug to the back shelves of my book case and found the book: The Seed Remembers by Albert Toops and Dana Aston, published by Old Mountain Press ISBN 1-884778-89-5,


    LOC# 00-108372


    I just may have to read it again...its been twenty years or more.


    Good point again Rod, interesting!


    Tman
     
  13. Lotus Rain

    Lotus Rain Future PLR Therapist

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    I grew up in New Mexico and Colorado, but now I li
    I have wondered about this a lot, because some of my past life memories match up to my family history. Such as, my mother's ancestors were Native American, and one of my memories is of being Native American. And my father's ancestors were Norwegian Vikings, and one of my past life memories is of being a Viking. And who knows what other memories could be connected to family lineage?


    But Eternal Light made a good point. There have been many memories of after death, so if those are real then the past life memories must also be real.


    I have also considered the possibility that we sometimes reincarnate down our family's bloodline. This could also explain why so many people reincarnate with family members. But who knows?


    <3
     
  14. Lawyer Daggett

    Lawyer Daggett New Member

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    stornado11- you refer to 'German' background and to the Nazi's.


    There is a big difference. Many Germans, including those in the armed forces were not 'Nazi's.


    Can you think of particular activities that identify your past with the Nazi cause? If not, I suggest you go easy on yourself.
     
  15. usetawuz

    usetawuz Senior Registered

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    My mom's only sister was a sixties college student and went to Cal Berkeley with the rest of the standard crowd. She joined the Peace Corps and went to Bolivia where she married a German Baron whose family had colonized Bolivia in the 1800's. While he was born in South America, when he was 18 he was sent to defend the fatherland. He had no sense of what they were fighting for and ensured that everyone in his unit was captured and properly fed for their term of internment.


    Funny, his second cousin was Kaiser Wilhelm and when I meditated to find out why he was here and also as my uncle, his higher self was laughing and almost singing "Why am I here?!" His son, my cousin, is a wonderful guy, but from a productivity standpoint and regular societal achevement standpoint, he really has done nothing...his time here is to do one thing,and as soon as he does it he is gone...it hasn't happened yet, thank goodness. His mother. my mother's sister, was to be my mother if my actual mother wasn't....she would make sure I was to participate in this current reality and fulfill whatever it is I am to acheive...whatever that is, I do not yet know, but alot of souls have been places to ensure it happens.
     
  16. katrien

    katrien Senior Registered

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    I have been studying genetic memory by myself for years now, I dream of my ancestors frequently since I was young and like genetics,I've had my genome sequenced & analysed four times.


    It has somewhat replaced my belief in reincarnation, though I still see it as reincarnation or ''inter-family reincarnation" where certain ancestors are biologically reborn into a later family members and also in the spiritual sense.


    Reincarnating from your ancestors is a common belief among tribal/ancient people ,the khanty for instance.


    My own little proof is that I have been a slavophile [obsessed with eastern europe] since I was at least 12 [you can read my early post abt it on here prior to ever having my dna analysed] I use to go to the library and take out every russian/hungarian music tape,book etc they had as a teenager and young girl.


    I Had a horrible time trying to explain to people why I collected hungarian costumes,russian music cds etc etc.I had NO known slavic ancestry at all,and still have found none.I recall walking into an eastern european [russian] bakery here in sydney and feeling the strongest familarity,If i met any eastern euro person I would rattle on and on abt eastern europe, bring out my ancestors photos and ask if they looked slavic. Even did my essays at design school on ancient eastern european jewellery.


    I pestered my mum for years did she maybe have some eastern euro friends when I was growing up that made me this way but she said no.I then decided it related to a PL.


    I got a dnatribes test in 2008 i think all my life I was tapping into something profound.


    DNA Tribes Analysis Results - Native and Global Match Strong/Strongest and Respective MLIs were: Serbia (96)789.34,Lodz Poland (92)491.46,Bucharest Romania(93) 378.98,Bosnia(92)324.59,Slovenia (91)315,275.45,Poladsie,Northeast Poland(87)270.8 the rest all in the 250's are (92)Hungary,South East Poland,Belarus.


    DNA Tribes Analysis Results - World Region Match Strong/Strongest and Respective MLIs were


    192.72 Eastern European,136.6 Northwestern European,85.69 Mediterranean


    this was just a few segments of junk dna,ive now had 1/2 million markers across my genome analysed and my top result was Russia.I also use 23andme.com and match there to a hungarian with a slovakian grandmother as does my father.Never in a gillion years did I think my instincts abt and attachment to eastern europe could be proved genetically.I can tell by the measure of the markers [100kb] that it is deep ancestry stretching more than 1000-2000 years to now.


    Genes have switches and I think certain memories are turned on in some people and not in others.
     
  17. StellarStarship

    StellarStarship Shanae

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    Question

    "Ensure it happens" Is this something that just affects your family or all families?


    When I was really little I had the feeling that I was here for something very specific. I told myself that I didn't know what it was but that it was "very, very, very, very, very....important" 5 "very"'s specifically.
     
  18. usetawuz

    usetawuz Senior Registered

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    I am sure there are similar specific plans with the majority of soul groups reincarnating together. I think it is more readily apparent in close and cohesive families, but I have only my own with which to use as an example. If you felt it that strongly, I would research further to see if you get an inkling as to what that purpose might be.


    Interesting to note that it appears my purpose is beginning to manifest itself. This October and November mark the beginning of dramatic changes in my life. I feel the energy around me crackling with portent and each day only increases the pressure. Imminent financial ruin, the possibility of dramatic domestic upheaval and possible divorce, and my guidance beating the drum that it is what I chose to do, that while it appears catastrophic, it is going to be a wonderful transformation and through it I will begin the purpose I intended for this lifetime...from the ashes will rise the proverbial phoenix, a new life and direction through which I will realize all I am intended to understand.


    Guidance is right now telling me "You will be ok, trust yourself, you will be ok, trust yourself...". I'm trying...
     
  19. StellarStarship

    StellarStarship Shanae

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    I am inspired by what you say Usetawuz. I know life is not easy. I am sorry to hear that you are in one of those 'not easy' moments. Hearing your view though, I know you will only come out stronger. I will try and keep the same state of mind when things come up in my life. I am however happy for you, that you will have the opportunity to fulfill your life's purpose.


    I think a lot of us come here with big plans (and then the reality of time sets back in) and then we realize it may be a bit harder than we anticipated. For those of us who do complete what we came here to do I commend you. For those of us who come here and do not complete what we came here to do, I still commend you; for being brave enough to try. This place is wonderful, but it can also be very overwhelming.
     

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