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alternative spin on "old souls"

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ssake

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There have been ideas presented lately about "starseeds" and "indigo children", which to me are basically variations on the idea of an "old soul". I've written my thoughts on all this before, as someone I think would fit roughly into these categories. Always, my reaction is caution at the way such people are glorified. So it just occurred to me to briefly share an alternative viewpoint, at least as regards myself.

Over the years, I've gradually been given to understand that it's not so much that I am ahead of the bulk of society in my development--though in a sense I am. It's more accurate to say I'm in "remedial training", being held over, as it were, from the previous graduating class. That means I screwed up in some basic ways in previous lives, and instead of moving on into a society that I would fit better into, I'm here to learn some lessons I missed.

While here, rectifying my mistakes may or may not involve helping or educating people. It would depend strictly on my karma.

But the royal Catch-22 is this. I am pretty sure, looking at my karmic pattern, that egoism is one of the lessons I failed and was "kept back" for. So that's why seeing people like myself glorified to the skies as "indigo children" and such sets off major alarm bells for me.

I attended a retreat given by Baba Hari Dass back in 1974, and one of the things he said that struck me especially, was: "Never think you are old, because to God all are children, and children always play." (He would "say" something by writing it on a chalkboard, to a person over there, but it would hit home to someone else on the other side of the room who, perhaps, wouldn't have asked the question but needed to hear it. At that time I would say, in retrospect, that I had a subtle pride and identification in being an "old soul", and I needed to hear this.)

So my suggestion is that there's a balance to strike in our attitude toward old souls, indigo children, or whatever you want to call them. The first is to acknowledge the phenomenon, because you're doing them a disservice if you fail to acknowledge their gifts and their special difficulties (both). The second is right valuation and not to give them a big head, because that's one of their biggest potential pitfalls.
Steve S.
 
Good thread and timely, on this forum a lengthy thread talks of King souls Queen souls baby souls etc. This leaves me scratching my head, but when all said and done its a new slant on an old theme.
As I keep repeating my back ground is Theosophists, old soul young soul is one off their concept .We naturally were all old souls well on our way to enlightenment.
There's a trap which catch's the weary traveller on the road of spiritual growth namely egoism. It takes many forms, I also call it spiritual superiority and I often catch myself exercising it Hopefully my awareness to this will help me overcome it.
 
I thought this topic might generate a little more traffic than it has as its comes to the fore on a regular basis.
I have given a little thought to the relatively new phenomena of labelling children starseed or indigo .a far as I can tell its five to ten years old. Once again it's nothing new round about the 1920 Alice Bailey wrote of the incoming wave of light bearers. Since then there has been much written on the subject. Apparently their is a influx's (dare I say it) of old souls who wish to the experience the currant conditions it may be true but should remain in the realms of speculation
Children's gifts and talents should be encouraged what ever they are, but there is a danger when labelling them in the above way .They are little sponges and would see them self's as different or more special than their peers , this may seem desirable but can lead to isolation . I know this from my own experience and can tell you it took a heavy toll on my self esteem .
 
Indigo Children

This is so interesting....and I'm so ignorant so please bear with me! I recently had an aura foto taken and everything around me was either "ultra-violet" or "magical violet", with all the Chakras the same color. I was classified as either being very sick or very spiritual and that I would encounter a spiritual experience. I did go through a spiritual experience subsequently (including having dream visions) during the stressful period when my 5 year old pet Green Iguana was sick and finally died.

Is an indigo aura the only way to define an Indigo Child? I'm in mid 40's (isn't this a recent phenomenon?!) and have only had spiritual experiences the past few years. I don't mellow with age, but in fact am still full of rage and prone to anger as if something in life is still unresolved.

Would appreciate any comments. Thanks!

JK
 
Steve presents an interesting POV about Indigo Children and Past Lives. This is a very old thread - but an interesting topic.
 
Old souls, slow learners?

This IS a very interesting thread.

I've said it before at this forum that throughout my life, people have called me "soulful" or an "old soul." Before I was old enough to go to school, my mother and her sisters agreed that there was a wiseness, "an old soul peeking out" from behind my eyes. Though I felt their intentions and everyone else's were always innocent, I would cringe a little inside at the thought of people thinking I was an "old soul," especially when I was younger, probably 4 or 5. I wasn't sure why it made me uneasy.

Then, when I was 13, I decided that yes, I was an old soul but that all souls are old so that in itself is not particularly special. I've always felt old and young at the same time.

So I addressed the actual meaning intended with the words "old soul" which for me, mean someone who is supposedly more spiritually "advanced" or "gifted" in some way that others aren't or aren't willing to embrace. I knew as early as kindergarten that others my age and even older didn't "get" or believe in the same things I did because they hadn't experienced what I had. So I didn't tell ANY of my friends about this spiritual aspect of myself until I was 14 or 15 and only then, what I shared was very limited.

Anyway, the conclusion I came to at 13 years old, was that I was quite the opposite of what was implied by "old soul," that I was actually a slow learner and the only reason I might SEEM "advanced" in any respect, the only reason I "get it" so quickly is because I got "held back" a grade or so, so to speak. That I'm given the same lessons to learn from over and over again. Though I've very limited memory of any lives that might support that claim in the slightest, I still feel it's true. And after reading Steve's post, I feel truth in this idea ring louder.

However, I'm not sure if any of what I just wrote necessarily applies to "star children" or "indigo children" or "crystal children." Or at least not as a blanket generalization. I tend to think the distinction between "old soul" and star, crystal, indigo children/souls is that you can be one and not the other or both at the same time.
 
I must say I've noticed the trend whereby almost everyone seems to think they're an 'old' soul. Furthermore there's a tendency to assume people with traits we don't like are younger souls or at least 'less developed'.

Well, maybe.

We know so little about ourselves that I'd be very, very cautious about drawing conclusions about someone elses state of spiritual development. Sure, maybe that loud, obnoxious, impatient jerk with a temper problem is a 'less developed' soul then yours. Or maybe he's more developed in a different way... you're not really in a position to know. Hell, maybe he's Jesus or Buddha laughing inside while he plays the roll of an %$&*@ for the sole purpose of reminding you not to act the way he does!

My gut feeling is that anyone who thinks they're an 'advanced' soul almost certainly ain't.

(Not that I believe any of this stuff. ;) :D )

Furthermore, I thought I'd throw out a thought about the whole 'special children' thing. Maybe there aren't any 'indigo' children. Maybe kids are exactly the same as they've always been. Mabye it's just that we're better able to see them for who they are. After all, in the past infant mortality was so high, families were so much larger, and day to day life was so much more difficult that it may have been harder to see each child as an individual. But now that we have smaller families, more time to focus on our kids, and we're past the 'seen but not heard' philosophy, we can see kids more clearly as unique and special people in they are.

Basically, what I'm saying is that perhaps kids haven't changed, perhaps its just our perception that has. We're more willing to see what's been there all along.

It's a little like how people think that natural disasters have been getting worse. It's just not true. 400 years ago a tsunami could kill fourty thousand people in SE Asia and the news might never reach Europe. We'd never even know it happened. A volcano could kill a hundred thousand in Indonesia and except for some nice sunsets we'd never know. But now with our global media we hear about everything as soon as it happens and in great detail. So it's not that there are more or worse natural distasters now, it's just that we actually hear about them, so there seem to be more.
 
Hell, maybe he's Jesus or Buddha laughing inside while he plays the roll of an %$&*

Yay!- I think if that´s the only thing that I really got in a lifetime, it would be well-spent...:D


My gut feeling is that anyone who thinks they're an 'advanced' soul almost certainly ain't.

Well, maybe that´s just J and B funnying with you again... ;)

(BTW on natural disasters, I would think it´s a ´both-and´ thing...
they get reported more and they have gotten more frequent)
 
Redgod said:
We know so little about ourselves that I'd be very, very cautious about drawing conclusions about someone elses state of spiritual development.

:thumbsup: I could not agree with you more, Redgod. There's this sort of "I'm more spiritual than thou" attitude that, while not prevalent as far as my experience goes, is present enough to concern me about the way some people approach their brand of spirituality--and impose it on others.

I have a tendency to think no one is really "older" or, rather, "wiser" than any other (which is what is generally meant by "old soul"), especially when it comes to the soul, separate from the ego.

Then again, maybe those who seem to pervert spirituality with an excessive "you're spiritually advanced, but you're not" paradigm are simply working to learn the lesson they chose to work on in the same way I chose to work on whatever lesson I chose. OR perhaps this personality might be an "outfit" these souls decided to wear in order to better teach others how to cope and grow from their encounters with them. I can't know.....at least, not as "Chance," the personality I "own" in this lifetime. Which brings me to.... :D

Redgod said:
Sure, maybe that loud, obnoxious, impatient jerk with a temper problem is a 'less developed' soul then yours. Or maybe he's more developed in a different way... you're not really in a position to know. Hell, maybe he's Jesus or Buddha laughing inside while he plays the roll of an %$&*@ for the sole purpose of reminding you not to act the way he does!

:laugh: Even though you don't "believe in any of this stuff," I'd say, as a believer in some of that sort of "stuff" myself, you are right on the money! Really, who IS to know what purpose one soul chose for their lifetime?

Similar to an illustrative example I read in Denise Linn's Past Lives, Present Dreams book, what if, before birth, you and and the "selfish, arrogant, hot-tempered blankety blank of a mother" who made/makes every minute spent with her a living hell in this life is really your closest friend on a soul level? You needed to learn patience in this life so you asked your best soul friend to help you learn it this time around. Because of their deep love for you, they said, despite putting their karma in the mix, "Sure! Anything for you. I love you." And at this level of existence, you'd agree to do the exact same thing for them without hesitation.

I think that what made me uncomfortable about this "old soul" thing from even a young age was the implicit (or maybe not so implicit) judgement and hierarchy in even using the term, at least as liberally as it is used by some, whether a person is aware of it or not. I could not articulate this as a child and it's something I didn't really attempt to articulate too well in the previous post.

As I said before, I really do feel old, but only in the sense that something of me has always existed and always will -- which I believe is true for everyone/everything else. In this way, I must believe that I am wise, on some level, in my own unique way and that this is true for everyone else in their own, specialized ways. Some wisdom has got to stick after so many experiences.

To get a bit Jungian, I feel that there's actually a collective, cumulative pool of wisdom we all have the ability to draw upon but we gravitate to and embody the parts we're closest to as far as our "individual" experiences. In my mind, this is all a very natural, matter-of-fact notion, almost a "law" in the same way that gravity causes water to run the path of least resistance. Maybe this is closer to what is intended by the term "old soul" -- that such a person is just synched up with a combination of different aspects from this wisdom pool that more obviously/directly promote harmony and growth in the self and others. Perhaps in others no one would think to call "old soul" in a million years there are aspects that contribute to an ultimate harmony and growth in a different, vital, but as of yet, not easily foreseen way.

Truthfully, I feel young in that I feel I'm repeating a lesson/lessons I didn't completely "get" the first time or maybe even the second/third/fifth/whateverth time around. Others might perceive me as somehow "special" or "advanced" from time to time because I've already done such-and-such before and got that particular part of a lesson pretty much down. But I'm really no "older" or, as might be implied, "better" in some respect because of it. In fact, that just makes me a slow learner! And now, speaking of repeating, I'm just repeating MYSELF, :laugh: and rambling along. :o :tongue:

Thank you for your post, Redgod. Your contribution inspired me to better put my thoughts into words. :D
 
Great thought provoking posts everyone. I'd just like to say a couple of things about Indigo children. I gave birth to one and I have a somewhat personal take on it. I think that calling my son an old soul or placing too much emphasis on the fact that he is special, thinks different things etc is placing too much responsibility on a 6 year old. He himself has noticed the differences and I feel the best thing I can do to help him to be fit to live in a society or with a wife is to guide him and not invalidate him. He needs to learn things that other kids don't have to learn so when he tells his 5 year old friend that he will die early in this life because he wasted his last one, I need to step in and talk to him about not saying everything that is on his mind.
I don't want to ramble so I'll sum it up to say that there is a greater responsibility with these kids because they can get misdiagnosed with ADD and medicated unnecessarily. They have higher drug addiction rates and just life adjusting problems. I think there is a danger in either saying there is no such thing as Indigo because these kids need to be dealt with differently. I know that no one is saying there is no such thing but if we keep in mind that there are kids who are different.
There are also few parenting books and few people who really understand what it is like to raise these little guys and I think more attentiveness is required to really raise these kids. I want my son to think that he is special for all of his gifts and for all of who he is. He has so much beauty in his little soul and its not all because he's Indigo or whatever he is.
Gotta go.
 
Newcomers

About old souls, my personal observation is of people who I realize are new to this planet and I can often recognize them. There is something different about them. I have a memory of being on this planet for a long, long, time. I would like to think, in my rosy world, that these people are coming here to help. I have to chuckle at them a little because they, like the angel in the movie "Michael" really want to enjoy physical pleasures, whereas an "old soul" or long time inhabitant of human bodies is a little more bored about it all in my humble opinion.

Colleen
 
Is There a Such Thing...?

:confused: Is there a such thing as a very young soul? I always feel like I am a baby in this world because up until my aunt taught me this past year (an I'm 19) I could not do simple things like write a check or make coffee the right way. I literally have NO COMMON SENSE. I am learning how to drive and I am terrible at it. I always forget which way to turn the wheel when backing out, I can't remember which pedel is the brake and which is the gas... All of my friends tell me that it is easy and that they can't believe that I'm having a hard time of it.

Some of the ways that I do things and think of things are the exact opposite of how everyone else thinks of things, my aunt tells me constantly that I need to use common sense or I have no common sense and it makes me think that I am either really stupid or just really inexperienced in 'life'. I've never felt wise and I don't feel like I've ever been wise. I know a lot but I am afraid to talk to many people because I am afraid that they will just think that my ideas are crazy or stupid or based on illogic...anyways, I always feel like everybody, including people half my age, are wiser and smarter than I am. It's quite sad, really.

I am always:
Confused
Unfocused
Daydreaming
Tired
Lethargic
Annoyed at the way the world is
Wanting to throw toast at our president
Wishing I understood/cared more about politics
Waiting for the Gonzos
Hearing alternative-folk music in my head
wanting to scream
 
Old souls, young souls, does it really matter? It seems to me that if we're all here, meaning alive, then our souls aren't seasoned or learned enough. A soul is ageless, and ideally is ever-evolving, until it reaches a point of purity/understanding/fullness/whatever. Once a soul has evolved enough, just maybe it joins the Cosmic Consciousness, or even starts back at the beginning . . . and possibly that "not knowing" is the most important factor.

John
 
True, It's more or less for entertainment

Everyone likes to hear a good story and that is just as good as any.

And, yes, it is only a matter of degrees of comparison, nothing to brag about.

And, I agree with you, there's gotta be more important and vital underlying purposes and truths. Let's have some fun finding it all out, but I don't know if I want to get on this roller coaster every again. I think I could be more creative than that!

Have a blast!
 
alternative spin on old souls

I would think that the defination of old soul would be the ability to walk in other peoples shoes-to know how they feel in difficult situations, the ability to have compassion and understanding way beyond the realm of most people. It is also the ability to see both sides of a situation, and deep wisdom that cannot be learned. It has to be inside one's heart.
 
What a wonderful view point Nora, and something that I think most of us would consider a worthwhile purpose and goal. It would be wonderful not to need hindsight.

John
 
I have come to believe, that just as the age of a person is less significant than their maturity level, so it is with souls.

Far better to be a mature 'young' soul than an immature 'old' soul.

I'm still confused about the whole indigo thing. One site says indigo children have indigo auras, another site says indigo children were identified by someone with synesthesia. And there are also crystal children and rainbow children.

If they can't even agree on where the term came from...
 
I think humanity is undergoing a DNA shift. We are a species in the midst of an evolution. But due to the fact that we are in the middle of it, it is difficult to get an objective view.

There are many websites now and books about Indigo Children, but I think what bothers me the most is the suggestion that some children are "special." We've compartmentalized them, fit them in a box for understanding. It is too bad really - because at that point we see them as something other than ourselves.

*S*S*S Most children have egos, and attitudes. They learn it from adults. ;)
 
Wouldn't it be a wonderful world if, instead, every child was thought of as special? I know one 4 year old who "inherited" his grandfather's attitude, ego, and odd sense of humor. He should have his on TV show.

John
 
All kids are special. Some kids with different characteristics need to be guided differently. Shy children need to be handled differently than assertive children and so on. Its really no different with Indigo kids. Not all of them have egos and attitudes unless they are a product of parenting that is contributing to that.

However, having a group of kids that seems to have many of the same characteristics, is useful to parents. You can take a look at what works for these kids, what has worked for other parents, how to motivate them, how to not let them rot at school.

There are some people that do not believe that there is such a thing as Indigo children. That's fine. All I have to say about that is that they are not currently parenting an Indigo child or do not have one in their life or they would believe it.

Is it really necessary for anyone to agree on this? Nope, not if you're not in contact with an Indigo child.

Vicky
 
I think humanity is undergoing a DNA shift. We are a species in the midst of an evolution. But due to the fact that we are in the middle of it, it is difficult to get an objective view.
Exactly! I couldn't have said it better. :thumbsup:
 
ssake said:
There have been ideas presented lately about "starseeds" and "indigo children", which to me are basically variations on the idea of an "old soul". I've written my thoughts on all this before, as someone I think would fit roughly into these categories. Always, my reaction is caution at the way such people are glorified. So it just occurred to me to briefly share an alternative viewpoint, at least as regards myself.
Over the years, I've gradually been given to understand that it's not so much that I am ahead of the bulk of society in my development--though in a sense I am. It's more accurate to say I'm in "remedial training", being held over, as it were, from the previous graduating class. That means I screwed up in some basic ways in previous lives, and instead of moving on into a society that I would fit better into, I'm here to learn some lessons I missed.


While here, rectifying my mistakes may or may not involve helping or educating people. It would depend strictly on my karma.


But the royal Catch-22 is this. I am pretty sure, looking at my karmic pattern, that egoism is one of the lessons I failed and was "kept back" for. So that's why seeing people like myself glorified to the skies as "indigo children" and such sets off major alarm bells for me.


I attended a retreat given by Baba Hari Dass back in 1974, and one of the things he said that struck me especially, was: "Never think you are old, because to God all are children, and children always play." (He would "say" something by writing it on a chalkboard, to a person over there, but it would hit home to someone else on the other side of the room who, perhaps, wouldn't have asked the question but needed to hear it. At that time I would say, in retrospect, that I had a subtle pride and identification in being an "old soul", and I needed to hear this.)


So my suggestion is that there's a balance to strike in our attitude toward old souls, indigo children, or whatever you want to call them. The first is to acknowledge the phenomenon, because you're doing them a disservice if you fail to acknowledge their gifts and their special difficulties (both). The second is right valuation and not to give them a big head, because that's one of their biggest potential pitfalls.


Steve S.
This is an interesting viewpoint and one I tend to feel is probably the most balanced one I've ever come across.


I really (and this is a personal thing) do not care for the terms 'old soul' or 'young soul'. I've met a number of people who used the 'old soul' label and it evidently went to their head - as an example, I remember in one forum a person stated something like "only old souls come back to take on such responsibility" and I thought to myself, "ONLY?! What's to say a so-called younger soul can't help out just as much?" So needless to say, all of this sort of thing just makes my eyes glaze over.


Even in my case the label 'walk-in' has negative connotations (I've had people assume that I was a total whack job, that there's 'possession', that I was just 'switching identities' and the list goes on and on) - and that's just the negative connotations...that doesn't count the expectations that people have of walk-in souls. And anyone who tells me that there isn't such a thing as these expectations, doesn't know what the heck they're talking about.


I feel the expectations are strongly tied in with the stereotype of the label, and that is why I really don't care to use it unless I have to. I realize that, in my case, the fact of the matter is that I have to use it to designate the difference between someone who reincarnated via birth and someone who reincarnated via soul exchange.


But at the end of the day...I really try to avoid all these sorts of things and instead try to find some common ground with others.
 
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Please note - all discussions/posts regarding walkin's or possession will be pulled.


They are topics that are not tolerated on this forum.


Thank You

Even in my case the label 'walk-in' has negative connotations (I've had people assume that I was a total whack job, that there's 'possession', that I was just 'switching identities' and the list goes on and on) - and that's just the negative connotations...that doesn't count the expectations that people have of walk-in souls. And anyone who tells me that there isn't such a thing as these expectations, doesn't know what the heck they're talking about.
 
Very interesting thread...I have often wondered about the differences between 'old souls' vs 'young souls' along with all the names we have come up with for them such as 'indigo' etc.

Phoenix said:
I have come to believe, that just as the age of a person is less significant than their maturity level, so it is with souls.
Maybe all souls are the same age...So being a old or young soul is impossible. I think the term simply referes to the maturity level of the soul. For example, I know my dad has had past lives since Roman times, but he is nowhere near as mature as some poeple I know. So his soul is 'old', but he hasn't learned all the lessons he could have. It is my belief that old souls are those who have taken learning seriously and put into effect the lessons they faced in past lives, instead of ignoring and repeating them, but they are still the same age.


Just my theory...
 
Deborah said:
Please note - all discussions/posts regarding walkin's or possession will be pulled.
They are topics that are not tolerated on this forum.


Thank You
I was wondering why that is.
 
It is fully explained in the Posting Guidelines.


The Past Life Forum is a private forum open to the public. The original purpose and mission of the forum is for parents with children who have past life memories.

Please note - all discussions/posts regarding walkin's or possession will be pulled.
They are topics that are not tolerated on this forum.
There are other forums for such musings. ;)
 
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