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My son" memories.

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v_68

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I'v heard about reincarnation but until my five year old son started telling me his memories I really didn't give it a second thought.It started out gradually talking about his other mom. then he became frightened because he died. At first I thought it was his imagination. I just wish I had paid more attention. Its been a year and now he doesn't remember his past life. At least I know she really loved him.
 
Dear v,

What you describe is very common (at least from where Carol and I sit). We hear of new cases almost every day that start with a very young child talking about his/her other Mom or Dad, things they did as a "big person" (like drive, or have a family), and often how they died. We see many cases that are just scraps of memory, like your son's. Every now and then we talk to the parents of children who talk constantly about their past life, with lots of details and usually matching behaviors.

Steve

------------------
Steve Bowman
Webmaster, www.childpastlives.org



[This message has been edited by Steve (edited 01-20-2000).]
 
v_68, I know what you mean, my son, too. And it's so depressing...

to me at least, that you can't easily find someone "legit" to share this with that won't think you're a NUT or that you're making up some far-fetched story. Our son started discussing his "Old Grandpa" from the moment he could speak clearly (18 months to 2 yrs), as he grew, he told us so many things so often, that after the initial "shock" (at his continued discussions about his "Old Grandpa" and at first thinking it was "imaginary", that we didn't write down these things, nor "document" them in any way. A little later on, he began to be insistant about certain things - like I KNEW where his "Old Grandpa" had lived. We went through so many albums (pictures) and every time we went anywhere I'd point out houses or ask him to show me, and he'd get ANNOYED and tell me I KNEW where it was because I'd taken him there. At that point I began to believe that there must be "more" to it. Through a series of events that just seemed to "open up" I finally figured it out - it still amazes me, and baffles me. The thing is that in some way I'd like for it all to be acknowledged by the "pros" in the field, but at the same time, I don't want my child exploited or for us to be made fun of. A few times I've mentioned it to "professionals" in the field, and have gotten what I felt was a brush off, perhaps because it's not fascinating enough. Those are the times I really wish I'd documented all the things he told us. I've considered hypnosis to recover those memories - but am a little afraid to go for it at the same time. Like your son, mine has come to the point, at 8, that he doesn't discuss it anymore. It's funny now, how much I miss hearing him talk about his life/experiences with his Old Grandpa, especially now that I know who he was talking about!! Sorry this is so long - I guess I just needed to unload.
 
Hi Audra,
This is a good place to share your story and you are definitely not going to get a brush-off. I'm sorry to hear you have had negative experiences in the past. Carol and Steve would be supportive, I'm sure, after all this is their field of study. I would be very interested to learn more about your son's memories and in particular, what you came up with to make sense of it all. As you probably know, Carol is specially studying cases of children reborn into the same family. Please tell us more -- you've got a sympathetic audience here!
 
Hello Elizabeth. Thank you for your kind support. I want to mention that this child is the youngest of our children, and was an unexpected/unplanned pg who arrived nearly 5 years after we had "finished" having children. I have always believed there is something "special" about him (not that my other children are NOT special, only that he was - and is - in some way "different") and now of course, I believe I may know what that difference is

As I mentioned earlier, he talked so much about his "Old Grandpa" that we (the older children, a couple aunts, a friend and his grandmother, and I) all just felt like "Old Grandpa" was "part of the family" - it was sort of "routine". There were many times that things he said left us looking at each other though (in wonder I guess).

The events unfolded in this manner. He was sitting on the floor in the living room chatting with the neighbor boy, and I was in the kitchen (out of visual contact but within clear hearing distance) doing dishes. I heard them chatting and then out of the blue, he told his friend. "My name used to be Nickie" That phrase caught my attention fully, and immediately (I can't describe the feeling I had, but it was feeling "riveted" I guess). He went on to say, "I went to live with my Old Grandpa when my dad died." (I am paraphrasing now, though this time, I wrote down what he said)

I thought he was having a premonition of sorts - and my heart was pounding, and I felt flushed. I didn't make it known to him I was listening. I realized that even if something DID happen to his dad, though, he had NO "old" grandpas (no grandpas living at all, in fact) in which he could go live with! At that point, I stepped into his view, and he looked at me, and smiled (it's a familiar smile, like I "KNOW") and then his expression "closed", and he turned his attention back to his friend.

I cannot tell you how shaken I was. I had goosebumps. I kept thinking over what he'd said, and what my mom had told me months earlier, about how since I'm doing the family tree, that I'd find something that made sense of all the things that he had told us (at the time I sort of "dismissed" that idea), I kept going over in my mind how was it possible that I was supposed to know where "Old Grandpa" lived, and how could I have taken him there, and Nickie who? (in relation to the family tree)... I mulled over it from time to time (it was never far from mind) over the next couple of days. I even showed my daughter (she's 20) what he'd said, and she was also at a loss.

(I am afraid this is getting TOO long, so will post another post to continue)
 
Continuing here...

A couple days later, I was driving up to my moms (it's a couple hrs drive) and spent time thinking on this whole thing. I sort of layed it out in my mind like this:

1) he has an Old Grandpa
2) he says his name was Nickie
3) he says that he went to live with his Old Grandpa when his Dad died
4) he says that I know where Old Grandpa lived, because I took him there, that we had driven by where Old Grandpa used to live.

As I drove I mentally sifted through the files (branches)on the family tree(both paternal and maternal)... I tried to think of anyone named Nick (Nickie) His grandfather's grandfather, whom he was named for, was Jesse Nicholas. So I thought about what we knew about Jesse Nicholas(1849 - 1908). He was raised by both his parents, his father, Jesse(1808-1880), not dying till Jesse Nicholas was grown. So I eliminated that possibililty.

Jesse, our son's Great-gr.pa, was also raised to adulthood by his father, whose name was Nicholas. This Nicholas was born about 1783 and died about 1863. As I drove I kept thinking over all the things our son had said, trying to see if anything "fit" anywhere. I sifted through these ancestors, their siblings (in my mind) and searched for anything that "matched". I also was chiding myself for even thinking along these lines. Yet I kept going back to how I felt when I heard him say "My name used to be Nickie".

I tried to think "who" had a Nickie (Nick, Nicolas, any variation), and ticked off each as they came to mind. Jesse Nicholas is a name that's handed down from generation to generation, till it got to Jesse Nicholas who died in 1908. (this made trying to see if any of the Nicholas' in the family tree "connected" with what our son had said, a little more of a challenge)

Since I know nothing beyond the Ancestor, Nicholas (whom we affectionately dubbed "Old Nicholas"), I began to work my way back to the present, sifting through his children... I was about 20 miles from my mom's when I "hit" upon something that seemed to make "sense" or "connect" - Nicholas ("Old Nicholas" had a son, named Jacob, who died when his five children were little, and he had a son named Nicholas. Each child (son) went to live with the family member whom the child was named for, little Benjamin, went to live with his Uncle Benjamin, little Jonathon went to live with Uncle Jonathon, etc. and little Nicholas? He went to live with his grandfather, Nicholas. At the moment my mind is acknowledging these bits of info, I feel like my chest is being squeezed, and the goose bumps raise up about an inch on my arm. I'm thinking "NO WAY!"

Upon reaching my moms I recant all this to her - she just sits there and then after like 10 minutes she says.. can we call Unsolved Mysteries??? (to which I promptly replied NO!!!) Then I told mom as we sat there - but if this were true, Jess says that I had taken him to where Old Grandpa had lived.... and right on the heals of that came another "revolation" - but this sent me up out of the chair and pacing the floor somewhere between excited and sheer panic. I HAD taken Jess with me, but HOW could he have known???? We (my mother and I) had driven the 1 & 1/2 to the county where these ancestors had settled, and we took the land description drove out to the original piece of land where Nicholas ("Old NIcholas") came to live back in 1856... but Jess was ONLY 2 months old!!!!! HOw could he have known????? I had not talked about it over the years, (the land, etc.) we had no pictures out, etc. etc. (there is no house there, but I had taken a snapshot of the piece of land, tho this was not out where he could have seen it, or known what it was) To be honest at this point I wasn't sure I could stand these feelings of excitement but panic

Upon arriving back home, I couldn't wait to share these revelations with my husband and daughter, and our other children. My husband calmly listened to me and at the end of my "tale" he just looked at me and said: "it's a co-incidence". My daughter, hearing him say that (she was 18 at the time) just stamped her foot in frustration (she thought he'd HAVE to admit it seemed unusual) and said she was off to take a shower upstairs. While she showered and my husband continued to work (across the table from me) I went to my file cabinet, searched out the file on Jacob and his family, and sat down to look at it again - I guess I expected it to all make sense to me. Of course it really didn't do anything initially - not till I looked down at Nicholas' birth date... and all I could say as I jumped up was "OHHH MYYYYY" and yelled frantically (yes, FRANTICALLY) for my daughter - she yanks open the bathroom door in alarm and (in a towel!) says WHAT??? I handed her the family sheet and asked her: "what do you see?" and she scans it, and then does a double take.. (she spotted it almost as quickly as I did) - and SHE ran downstairs with sheet in hand (in her towel) and says to her father - who is sitting there thinking we've lost our minds, and says to him.. "THEY WERE BORN ON THE SAME DAY!, Now what do you think?" - and he looks at the sheet, and says.. "okay, it's an INTERESTING co-incidence!"

So, now I believe I know who Nickie was, and who "Old Grandpa" is... The story doesn't quite end there - but that's how I came to figure out who "Old Grandpa" is.

I am sorry this has been so long - couldn't figure out how to type it more briefly!!
 
Elizabeth.. a couple more things.

When our son would talk to us about "Old Grandpa", he would tell things like how "Old Grandpa" took him fishing (our son had NEVER been fishing at the time), and once he told me how he out of the barn (loft) - and he looks at me and says "don't worry mom, I wasn't hurt"... I really WISH I'd written down everything he'd said. I wish I could remember what it was he revealed to my sister when we were visiting with her and her family - all I can remember was how she and I looked at each other with a wary expression - just wondering where he was coming up with this stuff. He could describe things in great detail - and I keep thinking now that if I had written these things down, I would know more about the lives of both "Old Grandpa" and of Nicholas (I do not know what became of Nicholas, I "lose" all traces of him after he marries). Sometimes I wish Jesse could tell me what happened, but I've never asked him. When he'd talk, he'd get a certain look on his face... I can't describe it, but it's "that look", and then, if you would try to question him about it, or draw further conversation related to it out of him - then you could see a "closed" look come over him and then there'd be "nothing" - he'd smile (that same smile I described earlier) and run off to play.

Thank you for reading through this, again I am sorry it's so long, but it was nice to "unload" it anyway, to share it, etc.

I also wanted to mention that I had no idea that Carol was doing a book on the family connection thing - I had not visited here for a long time - I did email her once to tentatively ask questions about our experience(s) but felt that she thought if I read her book, "everything" would become clear - actually I kinda thought she wasn't much interested, so I hadn't ventured back here till this morning.

The reason I'm so hesitant about "talking" I guess is that you can't just talk about the things that happen in our family (my mother and my sisters, and maternal side of the family) - my husband says we're just plain weird (tho he says that with affection). I don't like being labeled a nut-case, so I tend to keep quiet, though I yearn to share these things. I'm batting a 1000, today I shared our experience with Jesse our son, and on the adult board, I've asked for feedback for my daughter's dreams! It's like coming out of the closet !!
 
Hi Audra,
Well, I think your story is breath-taking! I may have missed a few details, so please forgive me if you already gave these -- but how old is Jesse now? What does he think of it all now? And most important (to me), what do you know of the person he could have been in his previous life? I gather he shares the same birthdate with the "young Nicholas"? Any other "coincidences" like similar interests etc? I think it's great that you have brought all this out! And it's particularly fortunate that you were aware of your family's history so that you could look for the solution as you did.
I've run across enough stories of children knowing things they "could not possibly have known" either because they were too little or even not yet born, not to mention the cases where they were not even conceived yet -- as I say, I've seen enough of these to think it is quite possible that your son witnessed the trip to what may have been his old home.
About that feeling you are having of coming out of the closet, isn't it great??! I'm glad your daughter is open to the possibility. Also, I don't think it's too late to ransack your memory and start writing down all that you (and other family members) can recall of Jesse's comments. It would really help to paint a clear picture of the life that he remembered.
 
Welcome out of the Closet Audra!!!!!!

And please do not feel your story is tooooo long..I smiled, got goose-bumps and nodded in agreement through the whole thing. YOU GO GIRL. Nut case - NOT!

Take Elisabeth's advise..she's right you know..it's never too late to document it all -- start now! It could prove to be valuable in ways you never dreamed possible.

Deborah

[This message has been edited by Deborah (edited 02-18-2000).]
 
Hello Deborah! Hello again Elizabeth

Elizabeth you asked how old is Jesse now. He is now 8.

What does he think of it all now? On occasion we have asked him a question, and he gets "squirmy", (uncomfortable?), so usually we don't discuss it. Everything he has revealed has been of his own account and never prompted (not with success anyway, he just closed up if you prompted him)

You also asked "And most important (to me), what do you know of the person he could have been in his previous life? I gather he shares the same birthdate with the "young Nicholas"? Any other "coincidences" like similar interests etc?"

I will try to give you a quick line so you can "see" where the connection is:

Jesse (b 4 Aug)
James
James Sr
Carl
Willis
Jesse Nicholas
Jesse & Jesse's bro Jacob
Nicholas (Jesse & Jacob's father)

Jacob's son, Nicholas, was born Aug 4th also. Jacob died when Nicholas was about 8 or 10 yrs old (1846). This Nicholas was married on the 18th of August 1859. My wedding anniversary is 17th of Aug.

I don't know what became of this Nicholas, what he looked like, or what his interests were, unfortunately. Jesse has also mentioned someone called "Stick" so I hope to continue searching for more info on Young Nicholas to see if this person "Stick" shows up anywhere (Jesse told us "Stick" was a nickname)

Hope I remembered all the questions - it has been, and still is, a lot to think about!!
 
Audra,

I just read this whole thread and followed your amazing process of discovery. I printed out a copy for Carol to read, and I asked her if she remembered getting your email.

Please understand, she gets a lot of email and mail and many are from parents asking for advice. If Carol answered every one of them she would never get any writing done. (We're in the home stretch of writing Return from Heaven: Reincarnation in the Same Family. When you see it, you'll recognize many similarities in the cases to your own.) And many times people are asking Carol basic questions that are answered in our first book, Children's Past Lives. (That's why we wrote it.) We understand they are excited and eager and maybe even "panicked," as you said you were, because they have just discovered that their own child has memories and they believe that it's unusual and weird (I chuckled when you said your mother wanted to call Unsolved Mysteries; that's a natural reaction).

The good news is that it's neither unusual or weird. From where we sit we can see it happens all the time. The resistance you ran into, both in your family and out, is the reason we don't hear about it more often (an idea that, coincidentally, I was just writing about for the new book).

So we want you to know that most of what you describe--even the way you overheard your son talking about it and the way you initially ignored it, then were obsessed to solve the mystery--is typical. The interesting twist to your case, and the reason Carol might want to talk to you, is the large multi-generations gap between the past life and your son's present life. The fact that you researched the geneology and visited the old homeplace made it possible for you to solve the puzzle. All of our current same-family cases are within three generations or less (great-grandfathers returning as great-grandsons, etc.), and all are characterized by having a living person, a "survivor" we call it, who remembers knowing the deceased well enough to recognize traits in the young one. We call this "overlapping incarnation."

Please, continue to share your story here in the Forum. As you've already seen, there's plenty of help and support here. (Thank you Elisabeth and Deborah). And I hope anybody else thinking of coming 'out of the closet' will be encouraged by your story to do so. The more who do, the easier it will be for the next person to admit to themselves and the world that their beloved relative has reincarnated in their midst. What good news that this happens, isn't it?

Steve (and Carol)



------------------
Steve Bowman
Webmaster, www.childpastlives.org
 
I have always found this a fascinating topic. I had been interested in reincarnation throughout my life, but when my son pointed at a hatrack one day before he was two years old and said, quite plainly "chapeau" I was convinced. No one around us speaks French and he was barely beginning to speak English. He is now eight and a very "old" soul in some ways, a very normal boy in others. I am fascinated to see what he becomes.
 
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